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Loudest bari mouthpiece?

15K views 83 replies 32 participants last post by  terryna 
#1 ·
I've been using a rico metalite m9 refaced to a .130 opening on my bari for marching band in highschool , and I'm looking to upgrade before I go to college in the fall. The college I'm going to doesn't provide school baris, so I'll likely be the only bari player. I want a loud, good mouthpiece that can make me stand out in the 350 or so member band. I've heard good things about Vandoren B95s, RPCs, and Lamberson DDs, and the Jody Jazz Jet looks promising as well. Has anybody played any of these, or have other suggestions?
 
#2 ·
I don't normally post plugs for my own products, but I recently got this wornderful and amusing customer feedback for the PPT Hooligan model, so I think you may find the information useful, maybe depending on your attitude towards the neighbours' cats.

The best analogy I can offer for this mouthpiece is that someone has just given me the keys to an F1 car to drive around the neighbourhood, a lot of very naughty fun but I fear I may have run over the neighbour's cat...(all sounds inclusive!)
 
#4 ·
I'll have to look into the PPT hooligan more. It certainly looks like a good mouthpiece, though I haven't heard much about it.

I've heard from a few players that berg larsons aren't for everyone, so I'm reluctant to buy one without trying one first. I'll look around to see if anyone has a larsen I can borrow.
 
#8 ·
I have a Runyon Quantum Smooth Bore Spoiler in a 12 facing. It is a CANNON. I like my bari pieces loud and bright. I had a Berg 120/0, but this one seems twice as obnoxious and loud.


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#9 ·
I think you should stick with the mouthpiece you're used-to. I'm sure a .130 can produce plenty of volume. It is completely unexpected and probably undesired by the director for the baritone sax to stand out in a 350-piece marching/concert band. You probably already are playing loud enough and although you might be able to squeeze a little more volume out of it with a different mouthpiece, you also might lose some depth in your tone which is critical for the baritone sax in a band environment. Obviously you know that the baritone sax in band/orchestra follows the bass line to a great degree, and penetrating projection on the low notes is extremely difficult and basically pointless, particularly on the field or street.
However, I have to admit, when I was 13 and plying the only baritone in the band, it was a Martin with a Brilhart Ebolin 5#, and I could hear myself on the 'oom-pahs' echoing off the brick school building about 250 yards away. But this was a much smaller band and much younger kids. When you get with 350 hard-blowing college people, especially in a crowded stadium, there is no way you can manage to stand out without amplification. You could give yourself a hernia or other injury just trying.
 
#12 ·
I hadn't thought of that. Do you think it would be a good idea to pay to have the chamber on my current mouthpiece enlarged instead of buying a new mouthpiece? My bari is a conn 12m, and the rico mouthpiece plays nearly half a step sharp on most notes in the upper register.
 
#14 ·
Just play a #5 reed and you'll be okay.
Maybe if I was superman. That's like slapping a tree branch onto a mouthpiece.

If you are not able to get the volume you want out of your current high baffle piece with 0.130" facing, the problem is not in the mouthpiece. You need to learn to blow through the thing. Go out in a field and do your tone building exercises there, with nothing to reflect the sound back to you. Get out of the practice room and you'll get out of that practice room sound.
I'm plenty loud on my current mouthpiece. I can be heard over the 9 sousaphones in our marching band when I really blow. I just wanted to see if there are louder and better mouthpieces out there.
 
#11 ·
If you are not able to get the volume you want out of your current high baffle piece with 0.130" facing, the problem is not in the mouthpiece. You need to learn to blow through the thing. Go out in a field and do your tone building exercises there, with nothing to reflect the sound back to you. Get out of the practice room and you'll get out of that practice room sound.
 
#18 ·
I can peel the paint off of walls with my current mouthpiece. I'm just wondering if there's a mouthpiece that can give a little more volume, or at least sound better. My m9 is loud, but it doesn't sound good, especially compared to my concert mouthpiece.
 
#21 ·
Loud 'n proud might not be the best way to win friends and influence people. Blending in would probably be a better strategy. College band ain't T.O.P.
 
#24 ·
If you have such intense desire to be the loudest in the marching band... you picked the wrong instrument.

Making the bari stand out is a good way to get on the director's bad side quick, especially in a band that size. Go for the tone man! And if you want to be the loudest, learn a brass instrument. I marched several years of lead trumpet parts, and my back thanks me as well for leaving the bari at home. You'll also get more projection and notice in the alto or tenor section of the band. Most colleges don't march bari saxes anyway.

It does sound like your Metalite is not a good match for your horn though with the intonation issues you mentioned. Get something that matches better and go for the tone, not the volume!
 
#26 ·
#30 ·
For your intonation issues, maybe you're having trouble controlling such a wide tip opening. Why not try something a little smaller? M5 is .100", M7 is .110", and a stock M9 is .120". Maybe a smaller tip/harder reed would bring your intonation into check.

Also, I've recently picked up M5, M7, M9, and M11 alto pieces, and M5 and M7 tenor pieces, and have found the smaller tips to actually be brighter and effortlessly louder than the more open tips. With a little practice any of the tips can go medium-dark to not-quite-Mindi-Abair bright, but the smaller tips (to me anyway) lean brighter by default. For the price it's certainly worth getting one each of all three current production facings, and spend the rest on a new case!
 
#32 ·
For your intonation issues, maybe you're having trouble controlling such a wide tip opening. Why not try something a little smaller? M5 is .100", M7 is .110", and a stock M9 is .120". Maybe a smaller tip/harder reed would bring your intonation into check.
I don't think the tip opening is the problem. I've tried playing my friend's ybs 61 with my m9, and it's perfectly in tune on that saxophone, and the high notes sound a little better, but my friend has a grafonite b7, so I'll try that and see what happens.

You won't stand out - accept that. The balance of the band is not your responsibility. Play well and go with it.
Even if I don't stand out, every member has to pull their own weight. I want to be able to at least contribute to the sound of the band.
 
#31 ·
I've been using a rico metalite m9 refaced to a .130 opening on my bari for marching band in highschool , and I'm looking to upgrade before I go to college in the fall. The college I'm going to doesn't provide school baris, so I'll likely be the only bari player. I want a loud, good mouthpiece that can make me stand out in the 350 or so member band.
You won't stand out - accept that. The balance of the band is not your responsibility. Play well and go with it.
 
#38 ·
Be also aware of the dangers of having a horn that size in the bleachers. Horns take a beating.

College only last 11 years, but a damaged horn is forever (or expensive to repair).
 
#42 ·
Doesn't a larger baffle usually translate to a louder sound?

Here's some information from a modern master on building tone.

And in this one the real saxophone lesson starts around 1:00. Notice how the 80 year old guy who knows how to blow and sing through the thing has a sound as big as a house with what looks like a Selmer Soloist mouthpiece and the young stud with the Rico Metalite has a pinched little sound.
Of course he's going to be able to have a good tone on any setup. He's been playing saxophone for probably ten times at long as I have, and I started bari only last year when a slot opened up in our marching band. My tone didn't translate from alto to bari.
 
#43 ·
Doesn't a larger baffle usually translate to a louder sound?
After a certain point more baffle ends up adding buzz, nasality, and shrillness, but not actually more volume and projection. The Metalite is already a high baffle "power" mouthpiece, and opened up to .130 it's going to be even more so.

Of course he's going to be able to have a good tone on any setup. He's been playing saxophone for probably ten times at long as I have, and I started bari only last year when a slot opened up in our marching band. My tone didn't translate from alto to bari.
My point was that the way to get more sound out of a baritone sax is to build your ability to blow through it. There's not an equipment based shortcut. Watch the videos and internalize what Joe T is saying. Then do your best to apply it to yourself.
 
#46 ·
My point was that the way to get more sound out of a baritone sax is to build your ability to blow through it. There's not an equipment based shortcut. Watch the videos and internalize what Joe T is saying. Then do your best to apply it to yourself.
Ok. I'll try to take my bari home more so that I can practice. I'll wait to pick a new mouthpiece until I'm happy with the tone I can produce on my m9.

Sorry, I just noticed this from yesterday. A Graftonite is definitely not the same mouthpiece. Try smaller Metalites if you can find them.

Also, I'm still not entirely sure I understand why you want something so loud? If you want to stick out above the rest of the ensemble for no other reason than "just cuz," you're kind of missing the point of "musicality."

Sorry, now that I'm more awake than I was yesterday I feel the need to delve into this a little more.
I originally did want to be loud just for the fun of it. When I discovered how loud I was on my setup it impressed a lot of other people in band, so that's just what I rode on as something unique about me as a musician. But after hearing everyone's suggestions on here, I think it'd be better to wait a little bit to buy a new mouthpiece, and consider more about them than just volume. I'd still like a loud mouthpiece, just more to contribute to the overall sound of the band rather than to try and stick out.
 
#41 ·
Here's some information from a modern master on building tone.





And in this one the real saxophone lesson starts around 1:00. Notice how the 80 year old guy who knows how to blow and sing through the thing has a sound as big as a house with what looks like a Selmer Soloist mouthpiece and the young stud with the Rico Metalite has a pinched little sound.
 
#48 ·
Some years ago I played bari in a community college jazz band that had no respect for dynamics; they played everything fortissimo. Out of self-defense I gravitated toward using a Metalite M9 just so I could be heard.

Honestly, how hard is it to listen for the solo and, if you can't hear it, play softer? But I digress.

Eventually I got to the point where I found the Metalite kind of buzzy and not very interesting tonally. As many of us do, I went on a quest for a new mouthpiece

My current favorite is a JodyJazz DV 7*. Very loud with some edge when you get on it but also blends well when you back off. Works on a low A Mauriat 300 as well as a 1935 King Zephyr. The Zeph has similar intonation tendencies to a 12m and is quite manageable with this mpc. A litle pricey new, but they do turn up on ebay occasionally.

Keep in mind that mouthpiece preferences are personal; "one size fits all" doesn't apply, else we'd all be playing the same one.

There is a lot to be said for developing technique. I never knew what people meant by "open your throat" until I played the bass sax for awhile. Really improved my bari playing.

If you have a teacher or mentor, or just a more experienced bari player whose tone you admire, with whom you can sit and compare notes (no pun intended) that may be more helpful than anything else. Like in the video with Joe Temperley

+1 on Joe's tone, awesome!
 
#49 ·
If you have a teacher or mentor, or just a more experienced bari player whose tone you admire, with whom you can sit and compare notes (no pun intended) that may be more helpful than anything else. Like in the video with Joe Temperley
Sadly the only bari player I look up to that I can meet with has been playing tenor exclusively for the past three years in college, and I'd imagine his tone would be different if he played bari again.

My band director is mainly a percussionist, and none of the assistant directors that help during marching season know much about playing bari. I could probably talk to the saxophone professor at the college I'm going to once I move in to the dorms, though.
 
#53 ·
I don't know if there are any professional bari players near where I live, but I'll look around.

Not a problem, he still knows how to play bari. Point is to play for someone more experienced, live and up close, who can give you suggestions *if necessary*. We can't really do it through the forum.
I'll try and see if I can play with him or find someone else.
 
#63 ·
I think you'd be better off heading to college first, and seeing what the environment actually is before upgrading that direction. I think your instructors will be able to give you better input into what suits you best.

In 1974 with the 25th Infantry Division Band being the woodwind section leader, I had all our clarinet players cross train to play sax in the field (parades, military outdoor ceremonies, etc.). Then, we used Berg Larson metal mouthpieces, the same ones we used for stage band. This is so we could balance out the brass section, that was larger than us. In many of the marches, saxes carry the counter melodies. But, we were interested not just in volume but quality as well.

In your college environment, the instructors are not only looking for adequate volume but quality. They are interested in your welfare, that you develop good technique and tone, etc. to be on the road as a professional performer or educator. You'll be a caliber above that in high school, of which volume alone is not grading criteria. The basses will do fine and the directors may not be looking for that projecting reedy bass sound in the field.

If you are ever augmenting a symphony orchestra, you'll find that the volume of a stringed instrument is considerably less than that of a reedy brass instrument. Control and quality of sound (intonation, tambre, etc.) become more important throughout the entire range of the instrument. What you see marked forte may indeed be a piano on the bari.

In my humble opinion, I'd say keep an open mind first and after getting further inputs from instructors and upperclassmen, then make your decision on the right type of mouthpieces.
 
#67 ·
Florida State is like over 450
Notre Dame and Michigan I think are 400
Penn State is maybe 350, might be a bit less
Clemson is around 350
Michigan State, Virginia and Virginia Tech I think might be around that as well
Georgia Tech
UMass
Minnesota
Purdue

There's a bunch more, but that's a start I guess.
 
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