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So I emailed Bob Mintzer

54K views 228 replies 79 participants last post by  meven ASC 
#1 ·
I've known Bob for many years but haven't spoken to him since he moved to California a few years ago. So I emailed him and we exchanged some information about what we've been up to. I told him that I was going out of the mouthpiece business and asked him to send me his address so I could send him one, a Super NY, my best work. He replied back with a thanks but that he's not into mouthpieces. A lot of you (I could name names) could learn a valuable lesson from one of the greatest players of our time. Get a good mouthpiece and stick with it and practice. Messing around with gear just messes with you and distracts you from your primary purpose. Messing with gear is a waste of time and that's coming from someone that's trying to sell out his inventory. Sorry, but a lot of you guys are too into the nonsense and not really into your music. Phil Barone
 
#4 ·
Well spake, knave.

And thanks for sharing that.
 
#6 ·
I didn’t see anything with trying new mouthpieces. My only problem is they aren’t new, just different old Links.
I guess he realized you sound the same on everything. It’s more about the mouthpiece being comfortable and not too reed picky.
 
#10 ·
It's good advice for students or developing pros; I'm no longer the former, and will never be the latter. Personally, I tend to stick primarily with one alto and one tenor piece, both by Ted Klum, though I play them on five different horns, each having its own character and quirks. Sometimes I'll use a Metalite on gigs. Does mixing it up hinder my development as a player? Probably.

But developing as a player is secondary to my primary purpose in owning and playing saxes, which is personal enjoyment. Trying out and collecting mouthpieces and horns serves that purpose, along with the research it involves into different producers, refacers, models, their histories, and their players over the years. Nonsense? Perhaps, but no more so than collecting stamps, antiques, Beanie Babies, or other useless items that people acquire for fun. YMMV.
 
#11 ·
I guess there's nothing wrong with it if you don't take it too seriously but people, people that still have a lot they can develop use gear as a crutch then it ends up becoming more important than the art. I see it all the time in my business and especially on here. To make matters worse you have people offering terrible advice. I was in the mouthpiece business almost forty years and I'm telling you, gear is highly overrated and most of the guys looking for mouthpieces can't play, or at least not as well as if they focused on bloody practicing and got some good education. Fast food is a big business and I love McDonalds but fast doesn't belong in the sax business. It just doesn't work. Oh, and McDonalds makes you fat and is unhealthy too. Phil Barone
 
#12 ·
Let me start by saying, I really like SOTW. I gained a great deal of knowledge about the history of saxophone players, the proper techniques of saxophone performance, and about the equipment that we saxophonists use. And, I have come across a good amount of "nonsense" on the forum. Sometimes I feel as though I'm separating the wheat from the chaff while using the search function and browsing over the posts. But also, I feel like much of this "nonsense" is fairly subjective. We have rookies that come to this forum and ask questions that seem dumb to us and many times they receive responses from members who have forgotten that we were all beginners at one point. Maybe that's "nonsense." Perhaps "nonsense" is worrying about which mouthpiece to use (while waisting valuable practice time!), even though we have to advantage to be in touch and in business with some of the world's best mouthpiece makers. Or maybe "nonsense" is spending time on this forum to read about a thread on Bob Mintzer, which actually isn't a thread about Bob Mintzer, but a thread on "nonsense". By the way, Bob might not be a guy who's "not into mouthpieces" even though I can count about 6 different ones I've seen him playing on (live shows and youtube). While we're at it, maybe being a jazz musician is "nonsense" because even the best performing artists struggle to attract an audience. I saw Chris Potter playing 2 sets at club, I stayed for both and though the 1st set was packed, the crowd definitely died down for the 2nd, I know, it's hard to believe, and the same thing happened when I saw Miguel Zenon. If you're a classical guy, then good luck getting a gig unless you're a professor. And the pop guys (who are also struggling in our abysmal music world) then you should be ashamed of yourselves for not being a "artist!" Maybe we shouldn't worry about "nonsense" and let people enjoy playing their "nonsense" saxophones instead of lecturing them. Sorry for the outburst. Kevin Miller
 
#13 ·
I'm sorry you feel that way but the post was not nonsense, I'm trying to help people avoid a trap that I fell into. Mouthpieces are a means to an end, not the end and I always try to convey that on here but you have people on here saying otherwise and it's BS. Once you get a good mouthpiece you should stick with it and practice. You're right, there's a lot of nonsense on here and there's a few mouthpiece makers just trying to sell their stuff, a lot of it junk to newbies and people that don't know any better. I'd like to see more posts of substance instead of people saying things that they don't know what they're talking about. And Bob has not had six different pieces. I've known Bob 25 years and he's had three in that time, three. But with all due respect you're obviously frustrated about something else, I was just trying to be helpful.
Phil Barone
 
#15 ·
Thanks Phil. I personally feel like the gear should be the very last on the list of concerns at my point in development. As a matter of fact, if you are looking for an individual "sound" you'd be better off getting intimately connected to a run-of-the-mill plastic student piece and sticking with it than jumping from one holy grail to the next. It's good to limit yourself and sometimes adversity or hurdles expose the best that you have to offer.
 
#18 ·
I’ll give you my feelings, as I have a lot of experience with mouthpieces over the last 35 years.

—Some guys will play one mouthpiece and be happy with that and never have a need or an urge to change mouthpieces. They play what they play on and they are happy with that and they don’t focus any of their time on anything but the music.

—You also have guys who play on a piece for a few years and then switch to something else for whatever reasons.

—There is also the guy that doesn’t mind spending $150-$300 on a mouthpiece and may change mouthpieces several times a year. He figures he can buy them fairly cheap and sell them and not lose too much and maybe he will eventually find something that he really loves and can stick with, from that process.

—Then there are the guys who are never happy with what they have, and need to change mouthpieces all the time.


There are many underlying reasons behind all these options that you and I may not understand, so I always choose to take the path of “it is what it is”.
People do what they do for whatever reasons. My feeling, is do what makes you feel good, no matter what. If that means playing on one piece and never getting away from that, that’s great. If it means buying several pieces a year because you enjoy trying different things out, nothing wrong with that. If you are a guy that is not fully happy with anything out there, maybe do what I did and develop your own designs and maybe you’ll eventually be happy. It sure worked for me.

*** You can’t buy chops in a box...you need to practice, listen, and transcribe. But I can tell you without any reservation, you can buy a better sound INSTANTLY. Mouthpieces make an enormous difference for me, and playing over Cherokee at 300 bpm in all 12 Keys has nothing to do with your mouthpiece. ***

All I can say is enjoy your journeys. None of them are right and none are wrong. They are simply YOUR journeys.
 
#100 ·
I'll give you my feelings, as I have a lot of experience with mouthpieces over the last 35 years.

-Some guys will play one mouthpiece and be happy with that and never have a need or an urge to change mouthpieces. They play what they play on and they are happy with that and they don't focus any of their time on anything but the music.

-You also have guys who play on a piece for a few years and then switch to something else for whatever reasons.

-There is also the guy that doesn't mind spending $150-$300 on a mouthpiece and may change mouthpieces several times a year. He figures he can buy them fairly cheap and sell them and not lose too much and maybe he will eventually find something that he really loves and can stick with, from that process.

-Then there are the guys who are never happy with what they have, and need to change mouthpieces all the time.

There are many underlying reasons behind all these options that you and I may not understand, so I always choose to take the path of "it is what it is".
People do what they do for whatever reasons. My feeling, is do what makes you feel good, no matter what. If that means playing on one piece and never getting away from that, that's great. If it means buying several pieces a year because you enjoy trying different things out, nothing wrong with that. If you are a guy that is not fully happy with anything out there, maybe do what I did and develop your own designs and maybe you'll eventually be happy. It sure worked for me.

*** You can't buy chops in a box...you need to practice, listen, and transcribe. But I can tell you without any reservation, you can buy a better sound INSTANTLY. Mouthpieces make an enormous difference for me, and playing over Cherokee at 300 bpm in all 12 Keys has nothing to do with your mouthpiece. ***

All I can say is enjoy your journeys. None of them are right and none are wrong. They are simply YOUR journeys.
I read the last page of posts just now, and I addressed these things here in my post on page 1, from the other day. Just thought I'd put it back up in case you missed it. I think it nails everything discussed. This post seems to be repeating the same stuff thats already been said, and I hope we don't keep beating the dead horse for too much longer.
 
#19 ·
I think the real nonsense is thinking that "messing with gear" is nonsense. It shows such an elitist view of enjoying the making of music. I may be wrong but only someone that doesn't understand the joy of making music would say that. Not every saxophonist is in the music business and jaded about gear. Yes, some get carried away with gear and go broke buying horns and gear and they still can't play half way to decent but part of enjoying the saxophone is knowing many different styles of mouthpieces and gear. It doesn't matter if you've found THE mouthpiece or gear that is best for you. It doesn't matter if you found THE horn of horns. Playing everything out there is part of the joy. It's part of the whole experience. It's part of gaining experience. Everyone plays for a different reason and not all saxophonists take themselves as seriously as others. There are many reasons why Mintzer didn't want to try another mouthpiece.
 
#21 ·
He replied back with a thanks but that he's not into mouthpieces.
Agree with your post Phil, but Bob should probably have added 'anymore' to the end of that sentence!

After so many years of playing on high level he can for sure state that, because he did find what he likes after having experimented in the past:
https://forum.saxontheweb.net/showt...playing-here&p=2633528&viewfull=1#post2633528

But younger and starting players have to find what works for them by experimenting.
 
#25 ·
Its great fun experimenting with gear but it can easily take over as Phil have stated and you forget about the music. In periods it’s ok because when I get tired on being creative and make music I can always startup logic in my computer and record my different pieces and explore the sound from the other side of the horn and try to understand what I want to sound like. Next day I may be more inspired making music again.

I was on a tubby link for 8 years before I tried another piece and realized life could be much easier, sweeter and louder! Today I cannot blame either my horn or mouthpieces really...
 
#26 ·
I agree with Phil and the others. You have to practice, practice,practice. You need to know your horn. You need a fully developed embouchure. When you change mouthpieces, you have to learn that mouthpiece. My favorite mouthpiece of all time is a custom made Ernie Northway tenor mouthpiece with a funky looking hunk of plastic in it. When i first began playing on it, I thought, "What did I spend my money on? this thing is awful." I had moved from a Link 8* to the Northway which I expected to sound brighter. It probably took me six months to get the sound that I wanted out of it.

I was a serious musician then (serious as in practicing four to six hours per day, then going off for a four hour gig at night). If I hadn't practiced as much as I did, I wouldn't have learned how to play that mouthpiece.

I read threads about players switching from mouthpiece to mouthpiece and I wonder just what they're accomplishing. Some players place too much emphasis on their gear and not enough on their practice and study regimen. I can understand why Phil Barone is throwing in the towel in frustration. I would too if I were making a mouthpiece for someone who has been playing for five years (or even ten years) and owns ten mouthpieces but STILL can't get the sound that he wants.

If you're going to shell out serious shekels for a mouthpiece, you better have serious chops to go with it.
 
#30 ·
If you're going to shell out serious shekels for a mouthpiece, you better have serious chops to go with it.
Why? I'm probably one of the mouthpiece hoppers that is referred to here, and honestly, who cares if I want to try a bunch of different stuff? I buy used, keep em if I like em, or sell them for pretty much what I paid if I don't. As far as it taking months to get used to a piece, honestly, if everything I try is based on a similar design (Links), it's a few days (or less) to fall into a new piece. I don't get the animosity toward people like me. And also, for the people who on this site lately talking about people not being able to play... if you're going to do that... maybe prove you can play first before calling other people out. So much bluster.

The crap talking around here lately is getting a little out of hand IMO.
 
#41 ·
Imho, the take-away from Phil's orig. post is- there is no magic bullet and no matter what you play on don't let gear detract from your focus on practicing. I think this is especially important for beginning and intermediate players that are consistently working to develop their tone or sound concept and master the basics. When an advanced or pro player experiments with different set ups I think they're better able to quickly assess if a particular piece is something they want to stick with.
 
#43 ·
I found Phil's comments to be refreshing and I have fallen into the try everything category. Not being a great (or even decent) player, I should have spent my time practicing more and continuing to take lessons and didn't. When I started playing 15 years ago I was far more focused, had weekly lessons and spent a lot of time on long tones and scales. This lasted for about 5 years. Then lots of work travel, I dropped the lessons, had more disposable income and bought lots of horns and mouthpieces and played less. I've cut lose all but the necessities and am down to a couple horns and mouthpieces I play.

There is a lot of hype from several MPC makers about the latest and greatest piece they are making that will work miracles for $300-$500. If you're in the top 2% of players who have put in their 10,000 hours of practice, perhaps it would let them produce their sound with less effort. For the rest of us, I suspect it's all about putting in the hard work and studying with someone who's been there and done that. By the way, I really appreciate and respect the artistry of some of the MPC makers out there. My favorite tenor piece is an 80's metal link that I had tweaked by Phil-Tone. First metal piece I ever liked and the difference when I got it back was night and day!
 
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