Should I Buy King Zephyr Special Alto, Condition Questionable... - Page 2

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  1. #21
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    Default Re: Should I Buy King Zephyr Special Alto, Condition Questionable...

    Quote Originally Posted by milandro View Post
    I
    This is, to me, the definition of a back up. One that you can play blindly as you play your regular horn.

    An alternatively sounding horn is a different thing altogether!

    This doesn’t need to be the same as your regular horn and gives you, purposely, another feel and sound.

    Suppose you drop your Mark VI and you will have to record with this horn, one that you only use incidentally, do you suppose this wouldn’t sound different?
    I'm confused. IMHO, if you are gonna own a second horn, don't you want an instrument which offers a different playing experience and tone than your main horn ? The beauty of saxophones is, they are all the same invention yet there's so much great diversity in 'em. SO MANY makers made fantastic horns....owning a second horn is the player's opportunity to experience some of that.

    Your notion also intimates, a bit, that somehow owning a horn which is 'different' in tone, ergos, blowing response from your main horn is gonna hobble the player should they have their main horn unavailable. That's pretty arguable.

    If someone has a second horn, they like it, they woodshed with it a little....then once in a while they probably will take it to a session or gig and play it. Once that is established, even if it sits in the closet for 7 months before they use it again, the majority of players will not be 'set back' by picking it up again.
    The quality of "one that you can blindly play as well as your regular horn" is 100% up to the player, not the horn model.

    Many a player with multiple horns chooses the second horn for a particular context BECAUSE they are gonna play it in a certain way which adds a certain something appropriate to that particular session/context.

    So if you have a Yani you love - and you have a chance to acquire a 6M, you aren't gonna nix it because 'it's so different, I am gonna assume that (after owning and playing it for a bit) I could not pick up the 6M and be really happy playing it at a session or out".

    It gets into the assumption of the backup horn needing to be in some way 'close' to the main horn. Again, a debatable notion to which I would say is easily trumped by the opportunity to expand ones experience with other horns

    Mblock has arguably the classic French sax. Now he has an absurd opportunity to buy a classic American one. If it doesn't work out, he probably walks away making a profit.

    My 2 cents.
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  3. #22
    Distinguished SOTW Coffee Guru milandro's Avatar
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    Default Re: Should I Buy King Zephyr Special Alto, Condition Questionable...

    depends on the purpose of the second horn.

    as I see it there are two different situations.

    As I explained, to me, a back up for a professional musician is a horn that he can switch seamlessly with his regular one and no one would notice the difference.

    In this way you can record or perform with the same ease as your regular horn should you ever need to do so.

    A completely different situation is to have an alternative sounding horn.

    In that case you might have ( like a guitar player on stage with several guitars) a horn for every type of music that you want to play.

    But this is not what I would call a “ back up”.

    Under THESE circumstances , sure, the zephyr is the perfect alternative horn to the Selmer because it will be different in any possible way, ( sound , feel, and so on).
    Life is just a bowl... some have cherries in it, some don’t. Those who have the cherries aren’t likely to share them though.

  4. #23
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    Default Re: Should I Buy King Zephyr Special Alto, Condition Questionable...

    Yes, this is true. I know folks who have cheap asian horns backing their Selmers because the ergos just feel the same or better, and sound and blowing response be damned. They even say straight out the horn doesn't sound good and it probably wouldn't hold up if used as their front-line, but they just can play it 'blind', as you'd say.

    I'd just say in this particular instance, you gotta grab this Special without letting the notion of 'it's gonna be so DIFFERENT from my Selmer" hold you back in any way. IMHO...the likelihood is the player is gonna score a keeper here, even if the horn is vastly 'different' in his/her experience with it.
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  5. #24
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    Default Re: Should I Buy King Zephyr Special Alto, Condition Questionable...

    I think that I have said several times that buying would be a great idea.


    I simply have made a point to clarify that a Zephyr , great horn that it is, is not a “ back-up” to play blindly compared to a Selmer but an alternative sounding horn.
    Life is just a bowl... some have cherries in it, some don’t. Those who have the cherries aren’t likely to share them though.

  6. #25
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    Default Re: Should I Buy King Zephyr Special Alto, Condition Questionable...

    Quote Originally Posted by mlblock View Post
    Thanks for the advice as always. The guy is talking 180 for the horn. I’m still a bit in the fence about it. If I decide to purchase I’ll be sure to send more pics!
    $180.00 is a swingin' deal - you could flip it here immediately for a significant profit. Buy it, and then see if you want to invest in an overhaul. Pictures cannot convey the amount of wear in the mechanism.

    I see that no one has yet commented on your question regarding the mouthpiece: That is a plug in the port that hosted a pickup - an alternative to drilling the neck.
    Go for The Tone,

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  7. #26
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    Default Re: Should I Buy King Zephyr Special Alto, Condition Questionable...

    milandro's distinction makes sense to me too. The Zephyr is my main jam horn, and a cheap Oxford (Bixley stencil) alto my backup, as it sounds a lot like the Zephyr, even if the ergos and resistance aren't quite as nice. The Martin is my alternate alto, and my favourite of the bunch.

    That said, I lately played the Oxford at a couple raucous party jams where I didn't want to risk damaging my Zeph, and really grew to appreciate it almost as much. Tonally it's in the same ballpark as the Zephyr, but more focused. That makes it ultimately a bit less flexible, which is almost welcome at my low-intermediate level of playing. It's actually giving me a bit of a complex--like a wine taster who realizes they prefer cheap plonk to expensive vintages. . . .

    In sum, mlblock, I'd buy that rescue Zeph Special in a heartbeat.
    A little bit louder and a little bit worse.

  8. #27
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    Default Re: Should I Buy King Zephyr Special Alto, Condition Questionable...

    Quote Originally Posted by ZootTheSim View Post
    ... I'd buy that rescue Zeph Special in a heartbeat.
    that is absolutely sure
    Life is just a bowl... some have cherries in it, some don’t. Those who have the cherries aren’t likely to share them though.

  9. #28
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    Default Re: Should I Buy King Zephyr Special Alto, Condition Questionable...

    I keep expecting a post from the OP saying "he sold it to someone else" .... can it be that a Zephyr special is going to stay unsold while this conversation is happening?
    On the other hand if the OP is "on the fence" at $180 he may just not want it that much which is fine too. I hope this Zephyr gets sold to someone who will rescue it and play it or sell it to someone who will. Sounds like there are plenty of candidates right here.

  10. #29
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    Default Re: Should I Buy King Zephyr Special Alto, Condition Questionable...

    many of whom have pledged to pay way more than the asking price too!
    Life is just a bowl... some have cherries in it, some don’t. Those who have the cherries aren’t likely to share them though.

  11. #30
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    Default Re: Should I Buy King Zephyr Special Alto, Condition Questionable...

    Quote Originally Posted by Somes View Post
    I keep expecting a post from the OP saying "he sold it to someone else" .... can it be that a Zephyr special is going to stay unsold while this conversation is happening?
    On the other hand if the OP is "on the fence" at $180 he may just not want it that much which is fine too. I hope this Zephyr gets sold to someone who will rescue it and play it or sell it to someone who will. Sounds like there are plenty of candidates right here.
    Yes I am waiting to see if the OP took advantage of someone by paying only 180 for this.

  12. #31
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    Default Re: Should I Buy King Zephyr Special Alto, Condition Questionable...

    So did you get that Zephyr, mlblock? The suspense is killing me!
    A little bit louder and a little bit worse.

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    Default Re: Should I Buy King Zephyr Special Alto, Condition Questionable...

    especially after all the warm words of encouragement and support ...
    Life is just a bowl... some have cherries in it, some don’t. Those who have the cherries aren’t likely to share them though.

  14. #33
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    Default Re: Should I Buy King Zephyr Special Alto, Condition Questionable...

    Alright, Wow. I'm so grateful to have spurred on such vigorous conversation!

    So the guy told me he sold it... Then he contacted me today and said the other buyer never showed. So I'm picking it up tomorrow. I called up a buddy whom works on horns and will most likely have it overhauled. If anyone is interested in it pre or post overhaul feel free to pm me.

    Otherwise I'm going to have some fun with this baby for a while.

    I'll be sure to post some more pictures. I look forward to having it brought back to life and appreciated again.

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    Default Re: Should I Buy King Zephyr Special Alto, Condition Questionable...

    Glad it worked out! Will look forward to before & after pics.
    A little bit louder and a little bit worse.

  16. #35
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    Default Re: Should I Buy King Zephyr Special Alto, Condition Questionable...

    Just picked it up today. Here are some pics...

    https://drive.google.com/open?id=1IP...iuphnVkzN6hXw4

    The horn is in surprisingly good shape. Pads are old but not dried or popping out. The only pads that don’t seal appear to be the ones on the bell as pictured. All parts for the neck are there. It just needs to be soldered back on. Neck lacquer is mostly gone revealing silver underneath. Unlike most specials there are no engravings on the key cups. The only missing pearl is the lower half of the side Bb key as pictured. The side F# pearl is more yellowed than the others, possibly replaced. There is some serious oxidation on the back of the bell and bow. Other than that there is a decent amount of what seems to be original dark brown lacquer. Maybe 60-70%. The engraving is off the the side, similar to the super 20 as applied to the earlier zephyrs but it still has the Zephyr keygaurd as apposed to the “eyebrow” guards of the super 20’s. Only 2 small dings, one on the neck and one on the bow. Serial #271xxx

  17. #36
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    Default Re: Should I Buy King Zephyr Special Alto, Condition Questionable...

    Now that's a diamond in the rough. Will be cool to see how it turns out!
    A little bit louder and a little bit worse.

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