Solo you shedded that had the most impact on developing your vocabulary? - Page 2

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 21 to 40 of 41
  1. #21
    Forum Contributor 2017 BrianMitchellBrody's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    6,436
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Solo you shedded that had the most impact on developing your vocabulary?

    Quote Originally Posted by saxetc View Post
    .. which sounds a lot like Jr. Walker.. for R&B Jr. is an excellent influence..
    Absolutely which is another one of my influences. I have never taken to bop or post bop but RnB playing I can feel.
    �We are what we repeatedly do.
    Excellence then, is not an act, but a habit.�
    ~Aristotle

  2. Remove Advertisements
    SaxOnTheWeb.net
    Advertisements
     

  3. #22
    duodenalsalmons's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Eastern great white north
    Posts
    150
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Solo you shedded that had the most impact on developing your vocabulary?

    Good question! I'm fairly new to transcribing, but have found Wayne Shorter's solo on Footprints to be a real eye opener for minor blues stuff and rhythmic phrasing.

    I found Dave Liebman's process on transcribing quite helpful in figuring out what to transcribe:
    http://davidliebman.com/home/ed_arti...ption-process/

    His suggestion is to pick a small number of solos but vary the type to get exposure to different styles and develop good phrasing, tone and vocabulary. Pick a blues, a 'rhythm changes', a standard, a modal and a free jazz solo to transcribe. Pick solos that you love, and pick solos that you can (just about) play. Then shed 'em.

  4. #23
    Forum Contributor 2013-2017
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Watertown, MA or Grand Cayman depending on the weather
    Posts
    759
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Solo you shedded that had the most impact on developing your vocabulary?

    Quote Originally Posted by duodenalsalmons View Post
    Good question! I'm fairly new to transcribing, but have found Wayne Shorter's solo on Footprints to be a real eye opener for minor blues stuff and rhythmic phrasing.

    I found Dave Liebman's process on transcribing quite helpful in figuring out what to transcribe:
    http://davidliebman.com/home/ed_arti...ption-process/

    His suggestion is to pick a small number of solos but vary the type to get exposure to different styles and develop good phrasing, tone and vocabulary. Pick a blues, a 'rhythm changes', a standard, a modal and a free jazz solo to transcribe. Pick solos that you love, and pick solos that you can (just about) play. Then shed 'em.
    Great article, thanks...
    Selmer Mark VI tenor, Yamaha 82zUL tenor, Yamaha YAS62 alto, Yamaha YSS475 soprano, Cannonball Vintage Reborn soprano, Yamaha WX5 wind synthesizer, various blues harps (Mississippi saxes), ocarina, didgeridoo

  5. #24
    echoes's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Derry, Ireland
    Posts
    83
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Solo you shedded that had the most impact on developing your vocabulary?

    Quote Originally Posted by duodenalsalmons View Post
    I found Dave Liebman's process on transcribing quite helpful in figuring out what to transcribe:
    http://davidliebman.com/home/ed_arti...ption-process/
    I've read bits of the advice he gives in this article in various discussions before but not the whole article, thanks for sharing the link!

    He makes some interesting points here. Like transcribing a small number of solos but covering the main areas such as Blues, Rhythm changes etc... and having a transcribing phase that lasts about 2 years. (That's probably 2 years where the student can spend 4 hours per day working on transcriptions, whereas it would equate to about 10 years of my limited time)
    Antigua SS4290 Soprano - JodyJazz HR* 6*; Selmer SA80 SII Alto - Mayer M6 & JodyJazz Jet 6; Selmer SA80 SII Tenor - OttoLink STM 7* Floridated by Morgan Fry & JodyJazz DV 7*

  6. #25
    duodenalsalmons's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Eastern great white north
    Posts
    150
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Talking Re: Solo you shedded that had the most impact on developing your vocabulary?

    Quote Originally Posted by echoes View Post
    I've read bits of the advice he gives in this article in various discussions before but not the whole article, thanks for sharing the link!

    He makes some interesting points here. Like transcribing a small number of solos but covering the main areas such as Blues, Rhythm changes etc... and having a transcribing phase that lasts about 2 years. (That's probably 2 years where the student can spend 4 hours per day working on transcriptions, whereas it would equate to about 10 years of my limited time)
    That's a fair point... I don't know how long it's going to take me to finish the process, but it all seems worthwhile and lots of learning can be done without the horn in your hands.

    I think he said in a masterclass I heard that he'd expect 30-40 hours of study for the first solo (PM me if you want the audio), so maybe 120-150 hours total. Not a small chunk of time, but when you consider lots of it could be done while multitasking like doing chores with headphones on or driving the kids in the car or whatever (that's working for me at least).

    FWIW it took me about 2 hours to write down the first 16 bars of Shorter's Footprints solo, so I guess I'll be done in another month! :-D

  7. #26
    Distinguished SOTW Member/Forum Contributor 2009 warp x's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Amsterdam
    Posts
    7,571
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Solo you shedded that had the most impact on developing your vocabulary?

    Blue Train

  8. #27
    Forum Contributor 2014 ZenBen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Posts
    1,781
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Solo you shedded that had the most impact on developing your vocabulary?

    Quote Originally Posted by AnderT78 View Post
    Sonny Rollins, Moritat on Saxophone Colossus
    I love Sonny's playing on that tune. Sometimes I think its the most perfect jazz solo.

  9. #28

    Join Date
    May 2016
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    45
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Solo you shedded that had the most impact on developing your vocabulary?

    For a slightly different response, I'd recommend learning a couple of solos of the same player. (but good "vocab" solos).
    This way you will quite likely experience some of the same ideas but in different contexts, which will help with making them "your own".

    If the process is to develop licks, spend most of your time on small, isolated lines that your ear can recognise as the type that you would like to be part of your playing. (Practicing the whole solo is really for the sake of style development I feel). Make sure you know what chords are under those lines, and learn them in different keys. (Try and get some backing tracks).

    If you'd like to be pointed to some classic licks to have a listen to, maybe readers could put up some. (youtube etc) Takes a bit more time, but some might be happy to contribute. I'll try and pin point a few if you're interested.

    Rob

  10. #29
    DTExpress's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Long Island, NY
    Posts
    611
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Solo you shedded that had the most impact on developing your vocabulary?

    Trane's solo on the studio version of Oleo, with Miles. Lot's of tasty, accessible content.

  11. #30
    DarrellMass's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Location
    W. Wareham, MA
    Posts
    685
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Solo you shedded that had the most impact on developing your vocabulary?

    Quote Originally Posted by mi000ke View Post
    I am primarily self-taught, but have finally taken a few lessons over the past year or so. Regarding my improvisation ability, the consensus feedback I have received is that I play well, everything is harmonically correct and even occasionally interesting, but I need more ideas and more vocabulary. The recommendation, no surprise, was to transcribe and shed some solos of the greats I admire.

    I am a late bloomer and have way less ability at my age to memorize solos or even licks than I use to. It requires way more time and repetition these days. That combined with my limited time left on this fine planet means I need to be efficient about which solos I chose to work on, as I figure realistically I will only be able to internalize one or two per year (unlike my last instructor who spent 10-15 hours a day for three years memorizing a large chunk of Parker’s omnibook).

    So… what solo have you shedded (or would recommend) that gave you the most return for your time spent in terms of vocabulary, ideas, and improvisational conception?

    (Please note I am not asking for your favorite solo, rather I'm asking about the one that had the most impact on your ability to improvise.)

    (also, I am purposely not mentioning who my favorite players are as I don’t want to limit the scope of recommendations).

    Thanks
    I'm pretty much like you, minus the lessons. Glad to see I'm not the only one who has taken the improvisational route to improvisation.
    I actually do not transcribe, preferring to think up my own licks, from whatever musical influences I've managed to absorb over the years.
    To date, my most influential song has been The Autumn Leaves, as far as broadening my range, improving my technical abilities, and allowing me a good solid base to lay down my own improvs on.
    Good luck with your pursuits, my brother.
    Strive to be better than the day before.

  12. #31
    The most prolific Distinguished SOTW poster
    Forum Contributor 2007-present
    gary's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Hawaiian homey, German resident, doing time in Texas
    Posts
    27,151
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Solo you shedded that had the most impact on developing your vocabulary?

    I kinda agree with what craigmultireedguy said. I played and studied a bunch of transcriptions, as well as listening voraciously, to/of Art Pepper. When I finally did get a good recording of myself during this period, I sounded more like late Sonny Red! Study all sort of transcriptions, but know that the end result may be morphed into something else, altogether.
    ____________________________________________________
    You can't blow it if you haven't lived it.

    "Even if I could play like Wynton Marsalis, I wouldn't play like Wynton Marsalis."
    - - Chet Baker


    TK Melody UL soprano
    Selmer S80 Serie II alto
    Julius Keilwerth SX90R tenor


  13. #32
    Forum Contributor 2016
    Distinguished SOTW Member
    Nefertiti's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Northern Vermont
    Posts
    10,549
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Solo you shedded that had the most impact on developing your vocabulary?

    Quote Originally Posted by mi000ke View Post
    I am primarily self-taught, but have finally taken a few lessons over the past year or so. Regarding my improvisation ability, the consensus feedback I have received is that I play well, everything is harmonically correct and even occasionally interesting, but I need more ideas and more vocabulary. The recommendation, no surprise, was to transcribe and shed some solos of the greats I admire.

    I am a late bloomer and have way less ability at my age to memorize solos or even licks than I use to. It requires way more time and repetition these days. That combined with my limited time left on this fine planet means I need to be efficient about which solos I chose to work on, as I figure realistically I will only be able to internalize one or two per year (unlike my last instructor who spent 10-15 hours a day for three years memorizing a large chunk of Parker’s omnibook).

    So… what solo have you shedded (or would recommend) that gave you the most return for your time spent in terms of vocabulary, ideas, and improvisational conception?

    (Please note I am not asking for your favorite solo, rather I'm asking about the one that had the most impact on your ability to improvise.)

    (also, I am purposely not mentioning who my favorite players are as I don’t want to limit the scope of recommendations).

    Thanks
    I honestly don't think you need to spend all your time memorizing whole solos. You have limited time like you said so I would focus on specific vocabulary that you love the sound of to add to your soloing. i also think approaching a new concept and getting that under your fingers might be a good approach also. For example you might know your triads really well already and a simple concept like using triad pairs over a dominant chord might be easy to implement and now you have a new sound and lines in your arsenal.........

  14. #33

    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Posts
    16
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Solo you shedded that had the most impact on developing your vocabulary?

    Sonny Rollins - Time on my hands; I believe it really thought me a lot about articulation and triplets.
    Great link to the Liebman site, thanks duodenalsalmons!

  15. #34
    Distinguished SOTW Member
    Forum Contributor 2014
    toughtenor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    the netherlands
    Posts
    2,238
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Solo you shedded that had the most impact on developing your vocabulary?

    Hank Mobley "the best things in life are free". Was my first solo I learned by heart. Followed by many others like Sonny Rollins ' "mambo bounce" , "on a slow boat to China", " No Moe", to name a few which I really liked..

    Right now I am trying to learn this one, of a dutch master player...https://youtu.be/fBUZMWxhS8M..
    I usually try to learn it straight from the audio without writing it down. But this one I did write down because a student asked me to.

  16. #35
    Distinguished SOTW Member michaelbaird's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Gallatin, TN
    Posts
    1,933
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Solo you shedded that had the most impact on developing your vocabulary?

    I figured out how to improvise from listening to "Jeanine" Cannonball Adderly Paris 1960 and playing other peoples licks that I liked like Pete Christlieb. I have had to learn many of other people's improvised solos, and some are just beyond me. So when I play a solo, I use their ideas at the key moments and add my own. I get ideas from all of the classical music I listen to but I practice blues patterns mostly to "blues in all keys" Aebersold. There is no one solo for me. I like to practice to records of the players I like, and figure out their licks, and it can be anything from a guitar player to a singer.

  17. #36
    Distinguished SOTW Member
    Forum Contributor 2014

    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Syracuse, NY
    Posts
    4,308
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Solo you shedded that had the most impact on developing your vocabulary?

    Brecker's Confirmation

    Tenor - '61 Mark VI w/Tenny Slant Tone Edge 7
    Alto - '66 Mark VI/Meyer 6/Caravan
    Soprano - '93 Yani S-900 w/Tenney Tone Edge 7

  18. #37

    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    1,067
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Solo you shedded that had the most impact on developing your vocabulary?

    Anything Brecker, when he was playing with Joni Mitchell.

  19. #38
    Distinguished SOTW Member/Forum Contributor 2012 dexdex's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Switzerland
    Posts
    2,742
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Solo you shedded that had the most impact on developing your vocabulary?

    Great question, and great answers. It is really very interesting to go through all of our different approaches.

    In my case, a lot of Dexter Gordon, 4 solos come to my mind:

    Second Balcony Jump, from the album Go. There is a written transcription on the web somewhere, from a guy from Britain if I remember well
    Driftin', from Hancock's Taking Off, by ear
    The Shadow Of Your Smile, live version from one of his European albums, by ear
    Darn That Dream, album One Flight Up, by ear

    Common "lesson" from all of them: take your time, shape the phrases, let them ring and reach out before you start the next one.
    Sop Yana SC880 - Vandoren V16 S6 - Fiberreed Carbon Classic MH ¦ Alto SA-II - Meyer 7M - Fiberreed Carbon M
    Tenor MkVII - Link STM 8* - Fiberreed Carbon M ¦ Bari SA-II - JJ ESP 7* - Fiberreed Carbon M
    Hear them on The Groove Merchant.

  20. #39
    Distinguished SOTW Member
    Forum Contributor 2014
    toughtenor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    the netherlands
    Posts
    2,238
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Solo you shedded that had the most impact on developing your vocabulary?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nefertiti View Post
    I honestly don't think you need to spend all your time memorizing whole solos. You have limited time like you said so I would focus on specific vocabulary that you love the sound of to add to your soloing. i also think approaching a new concept and getting that under your fingers might be a good approach also. For example you might know your triads really well already and a simple concept like using triad pairs over a dominant chord might be easy to implement and now you have a new sound and lines in your arsenal.........
    True. Though transcribing ( a part of a) solo will make you pay attention to a players articulation, intonation , time etc and all the other stuff that is not in the notes . I prefer to NOT really write out the notes but learn them straight from the audio and commit them to memory. I find writing down the notes more time consuming and a bit of a waste. The last solo I did write down but that was on request of a student..
    To get certain concepts in to my own playing I use only parts of a solo. Like maybe a diminished line over a dominant chord or something like that. And then apply it to other keys or other pieces/ forms..

  21. #40
    Forum Contributor 2013-2017
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Watertown, MA or Grand Cayman depending on the weather
    Posts
    759
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: Solo you shedded that had the most impact on developing your vocabulary?

    Quote Originally Posted by Robbo View Post

    If you'd like to be pointed to some classic licks to have a listen to, maybe readers could put up some. (youtube etc) Takes a bit more time, but some might be happy to contribute. I'll try and pin point a few if you're interested.

    Rob
    Yes, thanks!
    Selmer Mark VI tenor, Yamaha 82zUL tenor, Yamaha YAS62 alto, Yamaha YSS475 soprano, Cannonball Vintage Reborn soprano, Yamaha WX5 wind synthesizer, various blues harps (Mississippi saxes), ocarina, didgeridoo

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •