modern keywork on a conn

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  1. #1

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    Default modern keywork on a conn

    Hey--
    has anyone tried putting modern (yamaha 23) keywork on a conn 6m or 10m? I'm thinking about going for it...

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    Default Re: modern keywork on a conn

    i actually think that's what James Carter did, I could be wrong though.
    We eat and We sleep and We dance and We're dead.
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    Default Re: modern keywork on a conn

    SOTW member GraySax has had this pipe dream for years...he's been working on modernizing a Chu.

    http://www.fixmysax.com/chu/chumodernazation.htm

    Here's the thread where he's been leaving details & progress:

    http://forum.saxontheweb.net/showthr...sax+modern+chu

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    Default Re: modern keywork on a conn

    Check out these guys. There is a downright sexy converted Conn on their page. Fantastic work, and if I had the money this is where I would go.

    http://www.blashaus.ch/home.html

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    Distinguished SOTW Member/Logician Grumps's Avatar
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    Default Re: modern keywork on a conn

    Well now we know where Dr. Frankenstein has been hiding out all these years...

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    Distinguished SOTW Member blackfrancis's Avatar
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    Default Re: modern keywork on a conn

    Why not just play the Conn as is? When adjusted right it's just fine once you get used to it.

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    Default Re: modern keywork on a conn

    I remember reading (years ago) that Bob Ackerman had "souped up" (his words) a Conn alto with (I think) MK VI keywork. Read that in an old Sax Journal, I believe....

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    Default Re: modern keywork on a conn

    Quote Originally Posted by dshook View Post
    Check out these guys. There is a downright sexy converted Conn on their page. Fantastic work, and if I had the money this is where I would go. http://www.blashaus.ch/home.html
    Very interesting, a Chu body with Reference ergos. Of course the proof's in the playing, but that baby seems like if I had the loot, that would be my next (and last?) tenor. I started on Conn tenors, play a JK and love the vibes of JKs and Conns. Wow, what a sax! I didn't notice a price - anybody?
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    Distinguished Colorful Mouthpiece Designer Stan's Avatar
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    Default Re: modern keywork on a conn

    In my opinion there is really no need to put a modern keywork on a 6M... anyway if I remember well this man http://dbarrault.chez-alice.fr/ can do the job.

    Stan
    Just a couple of wonderful saxophones and many selfmade great mouthpieces

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    Default Re: modern keywork on a conn

    Yes - I am in the middle of the modernization project listed above - but I have been swamped with work so personal projects have taken a back seat for awhile.
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    Default Re: modern keywork on a conn

    There is a similar thread to this about James Carter's horn. He plays a horn that has been modified in Europe, yet at a very steep price, which I am not sure is worth the return, for the average player (which granted; Carter definitely isn't).

    I personally don't see the point of this because:

    1. You are destroying a bona-fide antique/collector's item.
    2 I would rather spend the effort instead of getting this done in practicing to become accustomed (and or adjusted) to the horn I already have.
    3. Any work you have to get done to it would be severely custom (read: even more expensive than getting an already antiquated horn worked on).
    4. (As previously stated) the supposed return on the ergonomics really aren't worth the effort to the average human being.

    However, having said all of that: IF this is something that is still worth it to you, and all modern horns are based on Selmer-style keywork, then why is Yamaha keywork going on a Conn? Why not use a new Conn's keywork? I could even evension a market for this in the Selmer-Conn custom shop, at a significantly cheaper price than 12 grand...
    I truly believe people that play occasionally can be the most sane, yet, those that play all the time can be the most unbalanced...

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    Default Re: modern keywork on a conn

    Randy Jones gold plated a Chu and put Yamaha keywork on it. It was a pretty sweet horn, tho I agree with some of the statements above. Once a Conn is set up well, they play like a dream.

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    Distinguished SOTW Technician BOPITY FUNK's Avatar
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    Default Re: modern keywork on a conn

    I intend to fit an articulated C# mech to 10m --some day?!?! The two alternatives; 1) mount the cup and arm to a barrel (hinge rod) to rest below the D key as a Buescher--extra long rod needed + 1 pillar--with spring
    2) mount above on short barrel to side of the lower stack as a Selmer etc. 2 pillars needed.
    In both cases alinkage on existing C# rod would be constucted to articulate the key--- thats the easy bit. 10m & 6m have direct movement to B&Bb so really that has no need to be improved and the long lever G# in my opinion is excellent as it is.
    I have put an adjustable Bb /G# bar on a couple of 10m's using hexagonal head 3mm studs, but to be honest it does'nt make 'em play any better. I suppose there is always that urge to improve on the original with a lot of guy's--myself included, but really the most effective improvements are the simplest ie; a good modern front F spatula and customisation of palm keys & C/Eb R/Hand pinkys. I personally like the R/H & L/H Thumb button/ hook to be in line plus repositioning of strap ring.
    Bopity

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    Default Re: modern keywork on a conn

    Quote Originally Posted by blackfrancis View Post
    Why not just play the Conn as is? When adjusted right it's just fine once you get used to it.
    This begs the question "....why do all modern horns have modern key work..?"
    I would say that it is far more comfortable & slicker. My (well adjusted) Big B sounds beautiful, but I cannot live with the archaic key work.
    Such elaborate & expensive modifications would not be considered unless there was a market for them.
    If you feel that you are in full control..... you are not going fast enough.

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    Default Re: modern keywork on a conn

    Man, this brings on a whole new level of GAS!

    Good Luck,

    Enviroguy
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    Default Re: modern keywork on a conn

    I play an original conn chu professionally (actually have been for the past 10 years or so). The one I have been working on to alter is one that had some previous work done that will never of been undone to make it back to a desirable unaltered vintage sax.

    I'll be honest - I am doing it because i want to. I have no intent of giving up my current chu - however when it is done - it could become my main horn - who knows.

    Old mechanics are fine - unless you like something more modern. - To each their own!!

    Charlie
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    Default Re: modern keywork on a conn

    I've seen Bob Ackerman's Mark VI Conn. He had a Conn alto (6M I think) cut in half to rotate the lower half to the right as on a VI, soldered the two halves back together, then added the Mark VI keywork. Interesting horn, and it played great.

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    Default Re: modern keywork on a conn

    I had a 10M and loved it except for one thing - the LH pinky keys. They just always gave me some inconvenience. Could I play the Conn with its ergos as is? Certainly. But if someone could've given me a more Selmer-Yamaha friendly little finger configuration and action, I would've taken it in a heartbeat and I would also likely still be playing the 10M today. Ironically, the 6M alto I had gave me no ergonomic problem whatsoever.

    As far as "destroying a bona-fide antique/collector's item" IMO a saxophone is an instrument for making music. I would have no compassion for a collector's lost opportunity. Collectors are, in a large part, one reason why excellent instruments have been overpriced and taken out of the hands of musicians who would be using them to make music, so scr*w them.
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    Default Re: modern keywork on a conn

    You should see the one I am working on - not only did i do that - but I also cut the bell so both tone holes are now on the same side (ala Selmer)
    __________________________________________
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    Never put off till tomorrow what you can do today - because if you do it today and like it - you can do it again tomorrow!!

    --Benny Hil
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    1929 Conn Chu Alto
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    1969 - Very Understanding Wife
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    Default Re: modern keywork on a conn

    To the best of my belief, Selmer, with their BA, was the first to introduce "modern" keywork in 1935.
    Why, I wonder, were the American manufacturers so slow to take it up?
    There are, of course, aficionados of the old "axles down the side" style, but as the "modern" system is now universally adopted it would appear to be the best.
    It could be said that the popularity of the Selmer was more a result of it's keywork & ergonomics than it's sound.
    If you feel that you are in full control..... you are not going fast enough.

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