Lenny Pickett's Reed

MikeR · 05-10-2003, 01:00 AM

I read on the internet the Lenny Pickett uses a #3 bass clarinet reed when playing his tenor sax. He has a great tone quality on Saturday Night LIVE. What is the advantages and disadvantages of using a bass clarinet reed with the tenor sax. Also I have heard of tenor sax players using bari sax reeds. WHY? Also how do these reeds effect the tone quality of the tenor sax? How will these reeds sound with the Dukoff D9 tenor mouthpiece.

Agent27 · 05-10-2003, 01:51 AM

I've always heard that Lenny uses Vandoren Blue Box #3's with a Berg 130/0 SMS.

MikeR · 05-10-2003, 01:57 AM

Agent27: That is exactly what I read on the internet only it was the bass clarinet blue box #3 Reeds. I will see if I can find the web site.

MikeR · 05-10-2003, 02:12 AM

Web site that states Lenny Pickett uses a bass clarinet reed is http://www.davemackey.com/snlband/97lp.html

colibri · 05-10-2003, 02:28 AM

I have a tenor metal 130/0/M and an alto 105/1/M metal Berg. Both of them have windows and tables that are a bit too small to fit standard saxophone reeds. This is very common with Bergs. The tenor Berg fits bass clarinet reeds perfectly (since they are smaller) and the alto one would fit alto clarinet reeds.

MikeR · 05-10-2003, 02:35 AM

Colibri, thanks. I think I will try the bass clarinet reed with my Dukoff, as I have a similar condition.

Mike Ruhl · 05-10-2003, 03:11 AM

I think it has more to do with the shorter vamp cut of the bass clarinet reed matching up with LP's Berg (a 130/0/SMS, with the short facing curve). I have played bass clarinet reeds on tenor, and they didn't work all that well for me, but I was trying them on a Florida Link, which has a somewhat longer facing curve. Tenor sax and bass clarinet reeds are the same width, but bc reeds are a little bit shorter, and thus have a shorter vamp. Hemke tenor sax reeds are cut with a shorter vamp, just in case you want to try them.

Also, it was posted in the old SOTW forum last year that LP was using bc reeds. Someone spoke with him after a performance and got it straight from LP.

The "other" Mike R. :USA:

MikeR · 05-10-2003, 03:18 AM

Meruhl, I appreciate your informative reply. Thanks a lot.

Mike Ruhl · 05-10-2003, 06:12 AM

You're very welcome. Have fun experimenting!

markieg · 05-10-2003, 09:25 PM

I started a thread about reeds on another forum. This is one of the answers I got:

http://www.saxquest.com/forumThreadV...;ThreadUID=351

↓Re: Switching reeds..... by kennyj on 3/19/2003 11:30:21 PM

So I'm sitting in a waiting area at LaGuardia airport in NYC. (this is about 1988) Plopping down next to me with his cup-o-java is a very familiar face. I suddenly recognize Lenny Pickett of Tower of Power fame, and now of SNL band.

We talk about a lot of non-music stuff, but then face-it, we're sax players, the talk goes to reeds! Lenny changed my thinking that day. I've been going harder and harder, biting my brains out, and still not happy. Lenny tells me that he changed his own life by going soft! He tells me that he's a much happier man since tapering down to 2-1/2 reeds! His lip never hurts, he adjusts his windstream, and BANG! He still sounds fantastic, his range is incredible, his execution sounds effortless, and on a 2-1/2!

Oh well, just another life-lesson, eh?

ii-V-I
kenny j

MikeR · 05-11-2003, 03:53 AM

Markieg; Speaking of reed strength, Boots Randolph played professionally on a #2 reed. In "Boots Randolph's Rock and Roll Saxophone" book it is stated that Boots had used his Dukoff D8 with a #2 reed for a "lot" of studio work. He later started using the Dukoff D9 with a #3 reed. I have never heard Boots play without a great sound. Thanks for your reply.

scottyhoop · 05-11-2003, 05:54 AM

I was recently using 3.5 vandorens on a dukoff D8 on alto. In a lesson with Eric Marienthal, he pretty much told me that I was working way too hard, and he would not even be able to get a note out on my set up, so we switched to 2.5. I had to do some work with embouchure and pitch, but I must say that I like the softer reeds.
I heard Lenny was playing on 2.5 vandorens. Softer reeds def seem to have more control to me now that I switched. Kinda cool to hear of somone playing a 2 vandoren on my mouthpiece when I was playing a 3.5. What was I thinking????
Scott

markieg · 05-11-2003, 08:07 PM

The other thing to remember about that post is that the guy who posted it met Lenny in 1988, so this is 15-year-old info. He may have switched, but when a person finally realizes the ignorance of playing harder reeds in a jazz setting they'll probably stick with softer reeds from that point on. I know when I'm done w/ my stock of LaVoz hard reeds, it's VanDoren Java 4 (barely softer), and then 1/2 step lower until I hit what I like. Just trying to make small changes in the direction I want to go until I hit what I like.

Mike Ruhl · 05-11-2003, 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by markieg

The other thing to remember about that post is that the guy who posted it met Lenny in 1988, so this is 15-year-old info.

As I posted earlier, someone posted the same info on the old sotw forum just last year after having spoken with Pickett.

Quote:

Originally Posted by markieg

He may have switched, but when a person finally realizes the ignorance of playing harder reeds in a jazz setting they'll probably stick with softer reeds from that point on.

Ignorant like Stan Getz, John Coltrane, Wayne Shorter...

Quote:

Originally Posted by markieg

I know when I'm done w/ my stock of LaVoz hard reeds, it's VanDoren Java 4 (barely softer), and then 1/2 step lower until I hit what I like. Just trying to make small changes in the direction I want to go until I hit what I like.

So let others do the same. I've been playing tenor a long time, and I happen to prefer #4 V16s. But I'd never be so presumptuous as to suggest that anyone who uses anything below a 4 is "ignorant".

colibri · 05-11-2003, 10:37 PM

Grover Washington and Branford Marsalis are both known for using hard reeds. They claimed that it's not possible to get a "real" sound with a reed softer than #4.

Mike Ruhl · 05-12-2003, 03:07 AM

I read where Branford said the reason he moved up to #4 Hemkes was to be heard over Tain.

markieg · 05-12-2003, 06:17 AM

I wasn't saying under 4 is ignorant. I was saying that what I did, and what I hear other people doing, is ignorant. This means starting in band class in elementary school on a Rico 2, and working your way through the LaVoz, possibly VanDoren (so far so good). After getting out of school and wanting to play in a jazz setting, still going with the biting your brains out (I was trying for a harder reed to improve my sound, LV hard to VD classic 4), and thinking that the harder reeds will keep your jazz sound. Therefore I'm stepping back into the Java 4 (softer than a LV hard) and then stepping down 1/2 step each time until satisfied.

colibri · 05-12-2003, 08:00 AM

Going on hard reeds to improve jazz sound seems to be a junior high thing. There are folks like Grover who wouldn't play anything softer than #5, then there are people like Ralph Morgan who believe you shouldn't work so hard. Players from both ends of the spectrum eventually finds their sound. Since ultimately we're all trying to get a better sound, it doesn't matter which direction you go as long as it doesn't hurt while playing. My $0.02

Mike Ruhl · 05-12-2003, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by markieg

I wasn't saying under 4 is ignorant. I was saying that what I did, and what I hear other people doing, is ignorant. This means starting in band class in elementary school on a Rico 2, and working your way through the LaVoz, possibly VanDoren (so far so good). After getting out of school and wanting to play in a jazz setting, still going with the biting your brains out (I was trying for a harder reed to improve my sound, LV hard to VD classic 4), and thinking that the harder reeds will keep your jazz sound. Therefore I'm stepping back into the Java 4 (softer than a LV hard) and then stepping down 1/2 step each time until satisfied.

OK, thanks for the clarification. fwiw, I played #2.5 or 3 Ricos or LaVoz mediums on tenor for a long time, then started to notice that either the reed strengths or my chops were changing. I gradually moved up through 3.5s to 4s over several years. I'm close to moving up again. Personally, I think reeds strengths are getting weaker.

mr00420 · 05-12-2003, 04:00 PM

Dexter Gordon always played #2's (Ricos in 'Round Midnight.) Lee Konitz couldn't even get a note out of Bird's set-up it was so hard. They both sound great, so I guess the point is: Different strokes for different folks. Moving up is fine, but I think some people do so for reasons other than a desired sound (kind of sax machismo progressed from the jr. high mentality.) If you move up gradually b/c your embouchure just gets too strong, so be it. But it's no more of an achievement to be playing on a #4 or #5 than say, a #2 or #2.5.
I occasionally play a #3 when I find one that sounds good for me, and I often use them when I pratice. But when I'm performing, I like the sound of a #2.5. Again, sometimes my #3s sound great, but I generally like the sound and feel of a slightly softer reed. They take a little more concentration, control wise, but they have so much sound potential.