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Thread: Holton Saxophone; Serial number registry

  1. #481
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    Default Re: Holton Saxophone; Serial number registry

    Sounds right to me. That thing always looked like some sort of shrine thing rather than a clown. Maybe someone from Chicago can figure it out. I still ahe an alto with it if someone needs a photo. Better yet, someone buy the horn!

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    Content Expert/Distinguished SOTW Member LaPorte's Avatar
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    Default Re: Holton Saxophone; Serial number registry

    Quote Originally Posted by soybean View Post
    The bell says; Norbert J Biehoff, Artist Model,
    Pat Applied For: B 202010 L
    The serial# on my L&H bari: B 202007, both were made in 1928 in LaPorte just before Lyon&Healy sold the factory to Frank Holton. My Holton bari has a Lyon&Healy serial# too: B 202699. Those numbers (202xxx) on Holton saxophones are rare exceptions that cannot be found in the Holton Serial # Chart.

    So your friend's baritone is made by Lyon&Healy, no stencil!
    Couturier straight soprano > Claude Lakey 7* > Vandoren java / marca jazz 2.0
    Couturier alto > Jody Jazz esp 8 > m.a.r.c.a. jazz 2.0
    Couturier tenor> Jody Jazz esp 7* > m.a.r.c.a jazz 2.5


    "Why would I play on an ordinary, modern horn if it doesn't bring any special character to the music?" Al Mc Lean

  3. #483
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    Default Re: Holton Saxophone; Serial number registry

    The clown face Lyon and Healy is on EBay. It is amazingly bright (like Holton) for a
    1920s era horn. I vote for a seperate thread for Couturier.
    jazzbug1
    Holton CSop,Rudy Bbsop,Rudy alto, RudyC mel, Holton C mel"Frankie Trumbauer Model",Rudy tenor,Mod.214tenor,Holton triple octave bari,Conn bass, A,Bb,C,EbBuffet Albert clarinets

  4. #484
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    Default Re: Holton Saxophone; Serial number registry

    Quote Originally Posted by LaPorte View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by soybean View Post
    The bell says; Norbert J Biehoff, Artist Model,
    Pat Applied For: B 202010 L
    The serial# on my L&H bari: B 202007, both were made in 1928 in LaPorte just before Lyon&Healy sold the factory to Frank Holton. My Holton bari has a Lyon&Healy serial# too: B 202699. Those numbers (202xxx) on Holton saxophones are rare exceptions that cannot be found in the Holton Serial # Chart.

    So your friend's baritone is made by Lyon&Healy, no stencil!
    My friend will be very interested to know that. I'm guessing your number (202007) means it was the seventh bari made in that style and that my friend's bari is the tenth. Biehoff was probably a musical instrument dealer or retail store.
    Life is too short for long tones

  5. #485
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    Default Re: Holton Saxophone; Serial number registry

    Quote Originally Posted by jazzbug1 View Post
    The clown face Lyon and Healy is on EBay. It is amazingly bright (like Holton) for a
    1920s era horn. I vote for a seperate thread for Couturier.
    Very good item description.

    Note that Lyon&Healy was the new owner of the LaPorte factory since 1924 (L&H purchased the E.A.Couturier Band Instrument Company which went into receiversip Oct. 1923. Six digit serial numbers (200xxx) and the 'face' showed up first 1926. The body is designed by E.A.Couturier at the beginning twenties, it has a wider bore than any other make at that time.

    The keywork/application is designed new by Lyon&Healy first 1925 and again 1926 with interlocking palm keys and L-shaped C#/G# key and one rod for for both keys. So this alto is made by L&H, the E.A. Couturier Band Instrument Company didn't exist anymore.
    Couturier straight soprano > Claude Lakey 7* > Vandoren java / marca jazz 2.0
    Couturier alto > Jody Jazz esp 8 > m.a.r.c.a. jazz 2.0
    Couturier tenor> Jody Jazz esp 7* > m.a.r.c.a jazz 2.5


    "Why would I play on an ordinary, modern horn if it doesn't bring any special character to the music?" Al Mc Lean

  6. #486
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    Default Re: Holton Saxophone; Serial number registry

    Quote Originally Posted by soybean View Post
    My friend will be very interested to know that. I'm guessing your number (202007) means it was the seventh bari made in that style and that my friend's bari is the tenth. Biehoff was probably a musical instrument dealer or retail store.
    I agree, addititional engraving by a dealer was very common. There are more examples.

    Lyon&Healy made baritones are very rare. SN's #202007 and #202010 are the only examples I've come across until now. L&H began his new numbering 1926 with 200,000.

    How does your friend's baritone sound? Mine is a project horn. I consider to give it to a professional repairman. The Holton bari is a project Horn, too. I'll try to fix it myself. Any tips which pads to choose?

    Felix
    Couturier straight soprano > Claude Lakey 7* > Vandoren java / marca jazz 2.0
    Couturier alto > Jody Jazz esp 8 > m.a.r.c.a. jazz 2.0
    Couturier tenor> Jody Jazz esp 7* > m.a.r.c.a jazz 2.5


    "Why would I play on an ordinary, modern horn if it doesn't bring any special character to the music?" Al Mc Lean

  7. #487
    Distinguished SOTW Member jazzbug1's Avatar
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    Default Re: Holton Saxophone; Serial number registry

    Mr. LaPorte- Thanks for all the interesting research. I never heard of Couturier saxophones until this thread and I am very impressed by their sound. Everyone thought L and H was made by Martin due to the tone holes. You have more detailed information than I have corny jokes.
    jazzbug1
    Holton CSop,Rudy Bbsop,Rudy alto, RudyC mel, Holton C mel"Frankie Trumbauer Model",Rudy tenor,Mod.214tenor,Holton triple octave bari,Conn bass, A,Bb,C,EbBuffet Albert clarinets

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    Default Re: Holton Saxophone; Serial number registry

    Quote Originally Posted by LaPorte View Post
    Lyon&Healy made baritones are very rare. SN's #202007 and #202010 are the only examples I've come across until now. L&H began his new numbering 1926 with 200,000. How does your friend's baritone sound?… Any tips which pads to choose?
    His Bari sounds wonderful. It's got a big sound, and plays in tune. He uses it professionally and it is his only bari. We've been using it on stage in a musical production. I have not personally played it, but I'll ask him what pads are in use.
    Life is too short for long tones

  9. #489
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    Default Re: Holton Saxophone; Serial number registry

    Quote Originally Posted by soybean View Post
    His Bari sounds wonderful. It's got a big sound, and plays in tune. He uses it professionally and it is his only bari. We've been using it on stage in a musical production. I have not personally played it, but I'll ask him what pads are in use.
    That are good news. I'm looking forward to the L&H bari when it is fixed. It's in pretty rough shape now.

    Felix
    Couturier straight soprano > Claude Lakey 7* > Vandoren java / marca jazz 2.0
    Couturier alto > Jody Jazz esp 8 > m.a.r.c.a. jazz 2.0
    Couturier tenor> Jody Jazz esp 7* > m.a.r.c.a jazz 2.5


    "Why would I play on an ordinary, modern horn if it doesn't bring any special character to the music?" Al Mc Lean

  10. #490
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    Default Re: Holton Saxophone; Serial number registry

    Newly registered alto Rudy Wiedoeft model #36336, #292, page15.

    There is one more pre R.W. Tenor on ebay, no serial# viewable.

    http://cgi.ebay.com/TENOR-SAXOPHONE-...3A1%7C294%3A50
    Couturier straight soprano > Claude Lakey 7* > Vandoren java / marca jazz 2.0
    Couturier alto > Jody Jazz esp 8 > m.a.r.c.a. jazz 2.0
    Couturier tenor> Jody Jazz esp 7* > m.a.r.c.a jazz 2.5


    "Why would I play on an ordinary, modern horn if it doesn't bring any special character to the music?" Al Mc Lean

  11. #491
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    Default Re: Holton Saxophone; Serial number registry

    Since I got a new tenor, how about a peek at Team Holton? Now I need a Bari and sop.


  12. #492
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    Default Re: Holton Saxophone; Serial number registry

    How about a C soprano going up to F? Got one....

  13. #493
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    Default Re: Holton Saxophone; Serial number registry

    I have a Holton C soprano, which is keyed to high F (squeeze!!) and I use it regularly. It's brighter in the top end and noticeably less oboe-like in the low end. Surprising what one step will do in tonal quality. I am fortunate to have found a Goldbeck C mouthpiece, and the Holton plays well in tune for a hand-made horn.
    jazzbug1
    Holton CSop,Rudy Bbsop,Rudy alto, RudyC mel, Holton C mel"Frankie Trumbauer Model",Rudy tenor,Mod.214tenor,Holton triple octave bari,Conn bass, A,Bb,C,EbBuffet Albert clarinets

  14. #494
    Content Expert/Distinguished SOTW Member LaPorte's Avatar
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    Default Re: Holton Saxophone; Serial number registry

    Quote Originally Posted by LaPorte View Post
    Early Holton's Serial Number Registry (four digits only)

    C-melody

    #6196 sp
    #7686 sp
    #9501 sp

    Alto

    #6311 sp
    Another '1909' Holton C melody saxophone:

    http://cgi.ebay.com/Vintage-1909-F-H...3A1%7C294%3A50
    Couturier straight soprano > Claude Lakey 7* > Vandoren java / marca jazz 2.0
    Couturier alto > Jody Jazz esp 8 > m.a.r.c.a. jazz 2.0
    Couturier tenor> Jody Jazz esp 7* > m.a.r.c.a jazz 2.5


    "Why would I play on an ordinary, modern horn if it doesn't bring any special character to the music?" Al Mc Lean

  15. #495
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    Default Re: Holton Saxophone; Serial number registry

    Early Serial Numbers

    Made by
    Frank Holton Co.
    Chicago

    # 639 Eb alto
    # 759 Eb alto
    # 848 Bb tenor
    # 1169 C-melody s.p. 'deluxe'-engraving
    # 1189 Eb alto
    # 1200 Eb alto


    Made by
    Frank Holton Co.
    Elkhorn
    WIS

    C-melody

    #6196 sp
    #7686 sp
    #8517 sp
    #9501 sp
    #9799 sp

    Alto

    #6311 sp
    [/QUOTE]
    http://cgi.ebay.com/Vintage-Holton-S...3A1%7C294%3A50
    Last edited by LaPorte; 05-25-2009 at 08:34 AM.
    Couturier straight soprano > Claude Lakey 7* > Vandoren java / marca jazz 2.0
    Couturier alto > Jody Jazz esp 8 > m.a.r.c.a. jazz 2.0
    Couturier tenor> Jody Jazz esp 7* > m.a.r.c.a jazz 2.5


    "Why would I play on an ordinary, modern horn if it doesn't bring any special character to the music?" Al Mc Lean

  16. #496
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    Default Re: Holton Saxophone; Serial number registry

    Quote Originally Posted by LaPorte View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by soybean View Post
    My friend will be very interested to know that. I'm guessing your number (202007) means it was the seventh bari made in that style and that my friend's bari is the tenth. Biehoff was probably a musical instrument dealer or retail store.
    ... Mine is a project horn. I consider to give it to a professional repairman.
    I don't consider any longer. He asks $6,000 for restauration. I'm happy to work on it myself now.
    I,m just preparing a neck tenon taken from a York parts horn (alto).

    Felix
    Couturier straight soprano > Claude Lakey 7* > Vandoren java / marca jazz 2.0
    Couturier alto > Jody Jazz esp 8 > m.a.r.c.a. jazz 2.0
    Couturier tenor> Jody Jazz esp 7* > m.a.r.c.a jazz 2.5


    "Why would I play on an ordinary, modern horn if it doesn't bring any special character to the music?" Al Mc Lean

  17. #497

    Default Re: Holton Saxophone; Serial number registry

    I have just joined. I am trying to learn more about my sax. its serial number is either 270 or 130708 it is a Holton Elkhorn, WIS. USA. It is a silver baritone sax.
    I want to know how old it might be and a little history if anyone might know any.

  18. #498
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    Default Re: Holton Saxophone; Serial number registry

    Quote Originally Posted by hhubbard View Post
    I have just joined. I am trying to learn more about my sax. its serial number is either 270 or 130708 it is a Holton Elkhorn, WIS. USA. It is a silver baritone sax.
    I want to know how old it might be and a little history if anyone might know any.
    Welcome to this great community, hhubbard!

    '130708' is the serial number and indicates 1939 as year of manufacture.

    '270' is the term for the series which means your 'Revelation' baritone (not mentioned in the engraving) has a specific state of development (e.g. ergonomics of the keywork). Some prefer the term (thre digit-) 'model number' which is a possibility, too.

    Would you like to show some photos of this rare baritone? If I remember correctly, there was one '270' on ebay more than 1/2 year ago with a very rare floral engraving just as the 'Professional' presented in this thread by Soybean in#301:
    http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x...pton/sax07.jpg

    Felix
    Couturier straight soprano > Claude Lakey 7* > Vandoren java / marca jazz 2.0
    Couturier alto > Jody Jazz esp 8 > m.a.r.c.a. jazz 2.0
    Couturier tenor> Jody Jazz esp 7* > m.a.r.c.a jazz 2.5


    "Why would I play on an ordinary, modern horn if it doesn't bring any special character to the music?" Al Mc Lean

  19. #499
    Distinguished SOTW Member and Champion of the Holton geauxsax's Avatar
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    Default Re: Holton Saxophone; Serial number registry

    Quote Originally Posted by hhubbard View Post
    I have just joined. I am trying to learn more about my sax. its serial number is either 270 or 130708 it is a Holton Elkhorn, WIS. USA. It is a silver baritone sax.
    I want to know how old it might be and a little history if anyone might know any.
    hhubbard,

    Welcome! The model is 270 ad the serial number is 130708. We've been assembling info on these underappreciated saxes. Member LaPorte has assembled a serial number list linkable from the SOTW home page. This is a huge improvement, as other number lists for Holtons have been notably inaccurate. Please check out the "modern vintage" Holton section too, as your horn should fall within that range. Lastly--we want some pics of that big bari!

    Geauxsax

  20. #500
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    Default Re: Holton Saxophone; Serial number registry

    A new addition to the Collegiate I list. These well made saxophones are hardly noticed, mostly regarded as Martin stencils. The body is 'Couturier' (LaPorte), no stencil!

    Quote Originally Posted by LaPorte View Post
    As announced, the COLLEGIATE I list.

    Soprano
    201849* sp

    Alto
    37xxx
    38015 sp
    38077 relaquered, originally silverplated?
    39224 sp
    39250 sp

    Tenor
    31602 sp

    Bariton
    202013* sp missing neck

    *stamped by Lyon&Healy
    Last edited by LaPorte; 05-30-2009 at 10:42 PM.
    Couturier straight soprano > Claude Lakey 7* > Vandoren java / marca jazz 2.0
    Couturier alto > Jody Jazz esp 8 > m.a.r.c.a. jazz 2.0
    Couturier tenor> Jody Jazz esp 7* > m.a.r.c.a jazz 2.5


    "Why would I play on an ordinary, modern horn if it doesn't bring any special character to the music?" Al Mc Lean

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