This is a follow up to several questions we raised about later Dolnet and how they sound. I recently purchased a M70 from approximately 1975. This is the model with a sharply offset bell (left angle), which requires to be played on your right-hand side. As usual with ebay purchases, there is some adjustment needed (pads, keys, rods and springs) but it is playable (with some problems in the lower register though). It is a very nice instrument and I test-played it with a Meyer 8, a Lebayle jazz Ebony 7, a Berg 110 and a Vandoren T75. Let's add that I am originally an alto and Baritone player, with little prior experience of Tenor apart from listening (I played a tenor Selmer SA80 for a little while). However, I had the opportunity to put it against a brand new reference 36 just for the fun of it (the comparison was not fair because the Dolnet is not at its best). First, the intonation is very good and even over the whole register, and even with the lack of adjustment. Second, it is a versatile horn that responded well to all the mouthpiece, except the Meyer (but that's my personal taste. I don't like Meyer generally). The best result was obtained with the Lebayle : rich subtones, powerful but also nuanced, bright highs. The berg was OK and the T75 as well but more difficult to control soundwise (more sensitive to the adjustment problems I described). The ergonomics is confortable, with the very responsive Dolnet octave mechanism and I think it has the potential to play fast enough once properly set up. Of course, you have to get used to the offset bell (and neck angle to compensate). I guess you must look like a very twisted fellow on stage! But it allows to play the horn very close to the body.
Last, I played the reference 36 with the Lebayle and though very confortable to play, it did not have the edge and complexity of sound that I found on the Dolnet. It was a bit buzzy, and not so impressive. As I said, this is an incomplete and unfair comparison. Like putting a brand new cadillac against a California that has slept in the garage for years. But what I heard made me think it was worth a rebuild. Here it is for the primary impressions. It is a beautiful horn with art deco handgraving (I can send pictures upon request).
I will try to give further impressions when I have time.
Sounds interesting. I think our discussions may have started a run on Dolnets, as a recent one (a Universal?) in a case with bright red interior went for almost $1,200 the other day on eBay. All you have to do is compare them to a Mark VI (or say they have a classic French sound), and watch the bids go up to double digits.... I must say, however, that I have opted to keep my 1973 Buffet SDA that came in the mail last week (kudos to Jim (aka "Kritavi") on a very smooth transaction BTW), as it has such a rich, luscious tone. But since it's one of the transitional ones (with the S1), it has a brighter, more Mark VIish sound in the upper stack. But I'm still looking to pick up a Dolnet, hopefully for about half of what the one above went for (we just need to start talking about how awful they sound!) How well do you think a LeBayle mouthpiece would work on my SDA?
You're right, we should probably close down this forum right away. I don't want to see Dolnet prices go up as high as Selmer. It would be a very regrettable side-effect. As for the M70, I still need to fix up a few things and it will have to wait until I have the money. The pads need to be replaced among other things. I will give more (negative!) feedback when it's done. When it comes to Lebayle mouthpiece, my local music store has just received a bunch of them with an alledgedly new chamber (the LR, larger one). I can't find more info because the Lebayle website is under construction right now. I was really amazed by the sound of the previous wood model but did not try the meral/rubber ones. I still need to make some tests to see how they respond on the tenor. I have very little experience with Buffet horns apart from an alto super dynaction that did not like my larger berg larsen rubber mouthpiece at all (.105). The best results I got was from a Freddy Gregory but I'm sure they are very versatile horns. Try the Lebayle, but I can't say for sure what it's gonna be like.
I thought I would just keep this thread running as I realize a few months have already gone since I started you guys on the M70 and how amazing it could be. Most of the time, this kind of thread either end up with the main author selling his horn out of disappointment/lack of money...or with everyone leaving the boat as time goes by and nothing new comes up. I must say my first impressions were so good I'm clinging onto the horn despite financial difficulties (usual for saxoholics). I decided to part with several mouthpieces so that I can keep the Dolnet and give it the overhaul it deserves. But I had an oppotunity to try it one more time when I borrowed a Vandoren T75 metal mouthpiece, alledgedly a screamer. And whaoh! even if this is not my kind of set up and sound, I was amazed by the response through all registers (but the very bottom end, because the pinky table needs some work). So, keep your breath and I promise to do my best within the next six months to give you a full report with photos (possibly sound samples) and maybe a M70 vs Mark VI contest. i'm working on it.
Hi Yohann,
Any more thoughts on the M70 as a jazz horn? I have a lead on a tenor and it looks (in pix) great. But the sound... You've been finding that it isn't the well-behaved classical horn of reputation, but how far have you explored so far?
Hello, Sorry I was not checking messages these days.
Hope it's not too late. What I still think is that it is a very versatile instrument (backed by thorough testing with different set-ups), that the intonation and mechanism felt very reliable, but these are so rare that I don't know if it's true of most M70s at all! Then, I'm not primarily a tenor player (but a listener, of course...). These are the caveats. I've not played it back to back with the all-too-famous Mark Vi. So, I have not much to add on what I previously said a few months ago. The horn is still in need of some regulation and will hopefully get it this Spring. It is indeed aesthatically nice, has a Selmeresque bell with the classical Art-deco features and the alloy is lighter than Dolnets from the 50s. I'm afraid there is simply too few M7O around to recommand it as something to look for desperately. But I would recommand buying a nice one, even with some work on it, for less than 1,000. I got mine for 700 and it will make a pretty all-round instrument for 300 more. Its sonic character is very appealing, even for jazz. Contrary to what Laurie Pimblett writes about his M70, I find it may have a lot of edge and projection with the right mouthpiece. Hope this helps.
Thanks, Yohann.
That does help. I'll probably at least check this one out, but it does seem a bit overpriced judging by what you say. If I get it I'll follow your lead and post a full report!
I love my M70 tenor. Although the construction is not as good as my super action II, and the overal quality is distinglty inferior, It is easier for me to pop up subtome and third register at least until C on the Dolnet. The reason for the bell offset is still a mystery to me. It has the brown lacquer with red pads. it looks fabulous!
I have an old M70 I bought back in the mid 1980s. Clarinettist, so this was the first attempt at trying a saxophone. London Notting Hill Music / CD / Record Exchange. Next to some shiny things, it was a bit battered (not dented - just "rust" and peeling laquer. Not working because it seemed to have been dropped on its head and the octave mechanism was bashed. But it had more presence than the shiny saxes, so I got it for £100.
Octave stuff bent back into the right neighbourhood, and I've been using it (sporadically) to this day.
Tuning-wise, it's flat at the bottom and sharp on top, but I've got around that after so many years. And anyway B&H 926 Imperials get you used to adjusting as you go along.
There was a very close-openinged Meyer mouthpiece in the box (an R4, whatever that might be...) Fairly quiet and with little dynamic range, unless you put a hard reed on it, I suppose.
Not much mouthpiece GAS action. I used a Link Tone Edge 7, and it was fine, if fairly undistinguished, then a Ralph Morgan Excalibur 5EL popped up on EBay. Holy Mother of God. Never looked back. I did also find a Morgan School Model in a shop for about £30 or so recently, and it is also pretty amazing. Less in your face than the Excalibur, but still miles more interesting sounding than the Link.
Also in the 1990s I found a really nice Bel Air Alto with the matching hexagonal guards. Ulike the tenor, it is spot on for tuning everywhere. Excalibur 6EL on that, because why wouldn't you?
It played OK but the mechanism was way too flimsy. Upsize all the rods a couple sizes and apply some precision to the manufacturing and it could have been a fine instrument.
I had one of those when I was a teen, an my teacher back then convinced me to get rid of it, since Dolnets were junk, in his opinion
(The same teacher told me that an Evette & Schaeffer clarinet was worthless ... the joys of the pre-Internet world )
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