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Quick question for the pro techs

7K views 47 replies 16 participants last post by  simso 
#1 ·
For the notes E2, F2, F#2, G2, G#2, the neck octave key is closed and the body octave key is open. My question is simple: could a bad or uneven seal on the neck octave cause some inconsistencies of sound in these notes? The reason I ask is that I've been having trouble with these notes for some time, and just for fun, I put a piece of 3 by 5 card between the neck octave key pad and the hole and then I closed it tighter with a rubber band. I did this thinking it would seal off the neck octave hole completely. When I played the E2 to G#2, it sounded pretty good without any effort. For the last year or so I have had to finesse them quite a bit to get a clear tone. Am I nuts or is this the problem?
 
#2 ·
A bad or uneven seal constitutes a leak. This will for sure make your instrument difficult to play. The relationship between the 2 octave keys is crucial -when one is open the other must be fully shut and vice vversa. Having found that using a card or elastic band your problem sees to go, the trick here now is to understand what is wrong with the octave mechanism. it could be a torn pad. or a compressed linkage cork, but it could also be one or more of a number of different problems : binding keywork, misalinged key post, the axle or rod screw could be bent, or the hinge tubing could have taken a knock and not be straight. the ends of the key hinge tube may not be smooth and have burrs, the pivot screws may not be true and causing the keywork to be sluggish, it could just be that theres old oil in there and its got hard. Once you have identified the source of the problem you can then go about addressing it and getting your sax back into good playing order. Get it to a decent tech who will be able to quickly pinpoint what the problem/s are with your mechanism and they'll be able to quote you for how much it will cost and how long it'll take. Good luck and let us know how you get on.
 
#12 ·
Though I agree with JayePDX, I understand what kingsax is saying.
A competent sax tech should not have to rely on his/her customers find out what the issues with a sax are.
If griff136 can come here and explain it to the point an answer is provided I have a hard time understanding why a tech cannot once told in person (by griff136) and by playing the horn themselves.
Really, time to find a competent tech that does not need you finding the answers for them.
JMO
 
#13 ·
Not infering it here (as I do not know), but many times people say "Ive taken it to a tech" and they cannot find anything, yet in reality it has not gone past there front doorstep, so never really gets looked at by a tech.

""If"" you have seen a tech, for this problem, and have same issue, find another tech.
 
#17 ·
I think to be a good technician you must also be a good problem solver.
If you can't identify faults, how are you going to be able to fix the problem. You also need a analytical mind so that you can fix the problem in the best way. I can make a sluggish key operate by strengthening the spring but I don't. I, like most, fault find and work out the best way to permanently rectify the problem.
 
#23 ·
I took my sax in for the umpteenth time to the two techs in town. I got lucky, the sax was distorting pretty obviously and when the tech tried to play it, it was just as bad for him. He checked for the usual things and said it would have to go back to the factory. If we sent it to factory, what would they do, give me a new sax?

So I wandered over to the next guy. I played it and then he told me to hold a distorted note. He reached over and pushed the body octave key a tiny bit more open and the d**n thing started playing clean!!! He then file down the cork and it seems (I'm not holding my breath) like it's fixed. He told me if I had more trouble, to bring it back and he would put a thinner pad on the body octave key. I'll let you know how this works out
 
#24 ·
I took my sax in for the umpteenth time to the two techs in town. I got lucky, the sax was distorting pretty obviously and when the tech tried to play it, it was just as bad for him. He checked for the usual things and said it would have to go back to the factory. If we sent it to factory, what would they do, give me a new sax?
Steer clear of this guy in future if you ask my opinion.

So I wandered over to the next guy. I played it and then he told me to hold a distorted note. He reached over and pushed the body octave key a tiny bit more open and the d**n thing started playing clean!!! He then file down the cork and it seems (I'm not holding my breath) like it's fixed. He told me if I had more trouble, to bring it back and he would put a thinner pad on the body octave key. I'll let you know how this works out
Go to this guy instead.

Good news you've got it sorted
 
#27 ·
YOUr first tech is not a tech.
Your second one does not seem to be familiar with making corrections by subtle bending. I can't think when I have ever needed to change a body octave pad to make the mechanism operate correctly. (And I would rarely sand a cork either; that tends to bandaid a different issue)
Is there a third, who can, in a few minutes, conclusively find the fault(s).
 
#28 ·
You know Gordon, I thought that too. I even chance it and do my own bending once in awhile. I've learned that a little is a lot. I just brought my sax back from the shop. I'm a little nervous about trying it-too many disappointments in the past. I've spent a year working one to two hours a day trying to get those notes to work. If it doesn't work this time, I may try a bit bending. What have I got to lose?
 
#29 ·
Well I played my sax and I have to say that at least half of the problem is gone. Not only does E2-G#2 hardly ever distort, the very little distortion that I run into seems to be completely confined to the E2. Also, jumps that were really hard for like D2 to G1 (the G1 cracks), are now really easy and sound good. I'm more or less resigned to the fact that I'm probably never going to get this sax completely fixed, but now I think that if I just get better, I'll be able to play through the problems of a broken sax. I can pretty much do that now.
 
#30 ·
OK, so I know everybody is probably sick of my saga, but I can tell you that no is is sicker of it than I am. I took it in again and the tech put a thinner pad on the body octave key so that the distance it would open would be larger. It plays almost perfectly now, only the very slightest hint of a problem (maybe my paranoid imagination) and I think I can handle that. At least it 's now fun to play the sax. I can tell you this without equivocation, if everyone went through what I went through, there would be no sax players in the world.
 
#34 ·
Probably not what I was thinking then. The octave mechanism on Yamahas was prone to a problem or two. Someone once sent me a service bulletin from Yamaha detailing how to correct an issue on it. Basically it showed how to bend the mechanism in the center of the swivel part. Hard to say whether your sax suffers from that issue, and I don't recall which models it related to. I'll try and search it out.
 
#35 ·
The 62 shouldn't have any serious mechanical issues related to the octave mechanism, no more serious than the Z, the 875, the Yani's, or Selmer Paris. They're all operating with the same basic floating lever design. When the G is depressed the body octave key should open as much as the G foot will allow without the neck octave lever moving. Problems can be caused by play in the mechanism and/or incorrect balancing of bumper materials.

Often leaks in the palm keys, LH C#, or side C/Bb will feel like a malfunctioning octave mechanism.
 
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