Bari v. Bari. Most Sought After?

**baritonesaxophone** · 01-10-2012, 02:19 AM

Hey Everyone,
I've been comparing and contrasting different players on different baris and have narrowed it down to the top 2 baris of all time:The Selmer Mark VI and The Conn 12M baris. I, for one, don't doubt that there are definitely some strong competition from other manufactures and other baris in general but these two baris really sit well with most people and have the most professionals playing them. So, what I'm curious to find out is... which one do you believe is better? Please state your reasoning and explain thoroughly why the Mark VI or the Conn 12M is the better of the two. Thank you.

**sycc** · 01-10-2012, 04:41 AM

We have 4 baris in our household. A selmer s-80 series I ,a 1948 Conn 12m, a Buffet 400 and a Rampone R1 jazz lowBb Bari! Both my daughters play sax znd myself! My S-80 series I is close to a mark VI! It's a 334xxx serial circa 1982 and is reputed to have a mark VI body and s-80 keywork! I have however played a low Bb mark Vi. Go got the selmer! I do not care for the block style pinky keys on the Conn 12m! I like the tilting spatula of the selmer! The conn's neck is to short do only large chamber mthpcs are on cork far enough! My daughter Hannah used a pickle barrel woodwind educator HR 5 w/ very good results! Intonation is a little better on the selmer as well! Conn tends to be sharp from high G to C #. The conn does have a bigger fatter sound than the selmer escpially down low! The Rampone has the Conn sound w/ modern ergos, a longer neck and a tilting spatula! The Buffet is a modern Bari w/ a dark sound similar to zkeilwerth!

**sycc** · 01-10-2012, 05:21 AM

Bottom line: Conn for a Mulligan type of sound and Selmer for the Pepper Adams/Ronnie Cuber type of sound/music! I got the Rampone for the Mulligan sound w/o having to deal w/ the Conn ergos!

**sycc** · 01-10-2012, 05:51 AM

You should go to a sax store like pm woodwinds,USA horn etc and A/B for yourself!

**baritonesaxophone** · 01-10-2012, 06:25 AM

Originally Posted by sycc

You should go to a sax store like pm woodwinds,USA horn etc and A/B for yourself!

If only there was any place like that in LA...

**Pete Thomas** · 01-10-2012, 07:13 AM

Originally Posted by baritonesaxophone

these two baris really sit well with most people and have the most professionals playing them. So, what I'm curious to find out is... which one do you believe is better? Please state your reasoning and explain thoroughly why the Mark VI or the Conn 12M is the better of the two. Thank you.

I've owned both. My work has consisted of mostly recording sessions and touring with rock/R & B but with some jazz work included.

I found the MKVI to be too weak sounding when I played it, but maybe that is due to comparing it with the 12M which to me has the best of both worlds: it can be a sensitive jazz/ballad horn as well as a real gutsy R & B horn with plenty of beef.

Having said that, I've given up both in favour of a modern Asian one that is as good and more versatile. However if I had to get either a Selmer or a Conn, I'd go for a Conn again, although I found it to be a bit mouthpiece picky if you are concerned about intonation.

**sycc** · 01-10-2012, 07:23 AM

Originally Posted by Pete Thomas

I've owned both. My work has consisted of mostly recording sessions and touring with rock/R & B but with some jazz work included.

I found the MKVI to be too weak sounding when I played it, but maybe that is due to comparing it with the 12M which to me has the best of both worlds: it can be a sensitive jazz/ballad horn as well as a real gutsy R & B horn with plenty of beef.

Having said that, I've given up both in favour of a modern Asian one that is as good and more versatile. However if I had to get either a Selmer or a Conn, I'd go for a Conn again, although I found it to be a bit mouthpiece picky if you are concerned about intonation.

Hannah would wholeheartedly agree! She always says the Conn has big" bark"!

**Pete Thomas** · 01-10-2012, 07:28 AM

Originally Posted by sycc

Bottom line: Conn for a Mulligan type of sound and Selmer for the Pepper Adams/Ronnie Cuber type of sound/music! I got the Rampone for the Mulligan sound w/o having to deal w/ the Conn ergos!

Oddly I found the Rampone to be more Selmer like, but I'm not sure which model it was I tried. Very nice horn though.

**sycc** · 01-10-2012, 07:46 AM

Originally Posted by Pete Thomas

Oddly I found the Rampone to be more Selmer like, but I'm not sure which model it was I tried. Very nice horn though.

Yeah the Rampone is bright like the Selmer but the low end is fat like the Conn!Also the Rampone is a bit fuller in the midrange than the selmer and isn't as thin sounding up top! It does sound more like the Selmer when I use the S90 mthpc I use on the selmer! I use a griefenhagen double chamber on the Rampone!

**xax** · 01-10-2012, 02:45 PM

King Zephyr! pretty much any vintage with a pro set-up. Why?...cause it can cut like a Mk but also, can swoon like a Lady.

**guido** · 01-10-2012, 03:35 PM

I have a very sweet mark vi low Bb bari that can swoon with the best of them. I have never found a Conn that plays as well. The key work on the Selmer is infinitely better as well.

my 2 cents.

**Little Sax** · 01-10-2012, 09:30 PM

Originally Posted by guido

I have a very sweet mark vi low Bb bari that can swoon with the best of them. I have never found a Conn that plays as well. The key work on the Selmer is infinitely better as well.

my 2 cents.

The problem I have with Selmer Baritones, coming from a Conn, is that the keywork feels like I'm playing an alto.
I don't have huge hands, but I really like the feel of the key layout and I love having a Forked-Eb on bari.
True, the left-hand spatula is lighter and easier to manipulate on the Selmer, but when I had to choose between a Low-Bb 5 digit and my transitional 12M, the choice was clear.

...someday I may choose to get a Selmer if I just have to have a Low-A and neither my PVC extension for my 12M or my CE Winds Alpha fit the bill, but for now the 12M has a more versatile sound and a more lush low-end.

As far as intonation goes, D2-E2 tend to be sharp and C#2 tends to be flat, but the rest of the Conn works very well in-tune. The previous intonation issues are minor (and not unique to Conn's) and can be adjusted for with embouchure changes and/or alternate fingerings.

**slojeepser** · 01-10-2012, 11:01 PM

We have a YBS 62 (my son uses in jazz band at high school). No mention above. Plays well and tone/intonation is very good. We have not tried a 12M or MKVI.

**singlereed** · 01-22-2012, 08:09 AM

They are all classics and I have enjoyed hearing and trying a number of them.I would just say I have a Yani B901 that I bought new about 10 years ago and it gets rehearsed weekly and gigged often, It has never needed any service and it just goes on doing its job. I have played funk, big band jazz and classical on it alongside players of Mark VIs, SA80-IIs and others and it always holds its own. I've used all kinds of mouthpieces on it and they all seem to work. My other sized horns are all Mark VIs and if someone offered me a bari I could afford, I am sure I'd be interested but the longer I have my B901 the less likely I feel I am going to part with it. Maybe it isn't a 'classic' but it'll do anything I ask of it.

**jthole** · 01-22-2012, 08:13 AM

Originally Posted by singlereed

My other sized horns are all Mark VIs and if someone offered me a bari I could afford, I am sure I'd be interested but the longer I have my B901 the less likely I feel I am going to part with it. Maybe it isn't a 'classic' but it'll do anything I ask of it.

Intonation wise your B901 is likely better than the Mk VI baritone saxes that I have tried.

**jthole** · 01-22-2012, 08:15 AM

Originally Posted by singlereed

My other sized horns are all Mark VIs and if someone offered me a bari I could afford, I am sure I'd be interested but the longer I have my B901 the less likely I feel I am going to part with it. Maybe it isn't a 'classic' but it'll do anything I ask of it.

Intonation wise your B901 is likely better than the Mk VI baritone saxes that I have tried.