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  1. #301

    Default Re: Vibratosax user experiences

    I think I'm about to buy a Vibrato A1S, as my first sax, from sax.co.uk :

    http://www.sax.co.uk/acatalog/Vibrat...axophones.html

    What accessories come with it? I know there's no case. I'm mostly just trying to work out what else I'll need to order.

  2. #302
    Forum Contributor 2012 edwin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vibratosax user experiences

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy H Chorlton View Post
    I think I'm about to buy a Vibrato A1S, as my first sax, from sax.co.uk :

    http://www.sax.co.uk/acatalog/Vibrat...axophones.html

    What accessories come with it? I know there's no case. I'm mostly just trying to work out what else I'll need to order.
    Interesting choice as your first sax! I guess that's what the makers are hoping for.

    Mine came with mouthpiece, ligature, one reed, a neckstrap (that you hardly need as the thing is so light) and a decent pull-through (for cleaning). I haven't spent enough time on it to really comment on the mouthpiece but the mouthpiece that came with the first A1S I had (which was from the first batch exported and didn't arrive in great shape) was not that good, in my opinion, and made it harder to play the sax compared with my regular alto mouthpiece. If you are a beginner it would probably be worth your while spending the GBP30 a Yamaha 4C mouthpiece would cost (from that website, you may be able to get it even cheaper elsewhere).

  3. #303

    Default Re: Vibratosax user experiences

    Thanks, Edwin.

    Yes, I'm a total beginner. I'll order a better mouthpiece as well. I might as well make sure I've got a reasonable chance of being able to get a good sound out of it.

  4. #304

    Default Re: Vibratosax user experiences

    Roughly how much of the "cork" (orange foam) on the neck of the A1S should there be showing with the mouthpiece on?

  5. #305
    Forum Contributor 2012 edwin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vibratosax user experiences

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy A1S View Post
    Roughly how much of the "cork" (orange foam) on the neck of the A1S should there be showing with the mouthpiece on?
    Hi Andy, not sure if you have already sorted this out but the answer to your question is relevant to the reason I came back to this thread today. In short, there isn't a one size fits all answer to this question because it depends on the mouthpiece you are using but also your embouchure. The aim is to have it at the right position to allow you to play in tune. This can actually vary over time - I now have the mouthpiece pulled back a little on my Yanagisawa alto compared with where it used to be (I know because I had to put a new mark on the cork). For me, with a Meyer 5M mouthpiece, the answer on the vibratosax A1S turns out to be "not much at all" i.e. I need the mouthpiece pushed in a long way to get G1 (concert Bb) in tune.

    Today, after playing mainly tenor for a couple of months, I finally got round to digging out my A1S and putting it up against a tuner. I used my Yani A991 as a comparison - not a fair comparison, I know, because the A991 is a very fine horn and cost me almost exactly 10 times as much as the A1S, and that was a good deal on a secondhand instrument.

    With the A991 I could play up and down the horn and mostly be in tune, or within 10 cents, without much difficulty. This was not the case with the A1S - it tended to play sharp in the upper register and flat in the lower. I could lip it down fairly easily when sharp but battled to get it up when flat.

    Now, an added element to the unfairness is that I've owned the Yani for a couple of years and have played it quite a bit. My alto embouchure is probably adapted to this specific horn. And I haven't been playing that long and can't easily adjust by ear as I play (my pitch sense isn't that great I fear, although I can sing a note in tune with a note from an instrument without difficulty). My impression is that with practice I probably could play the A1S mostly in tune, or maybe completely in tune. But it wouldn't come automatically for me.

    One other issue is that D2 is a struggle on the A1S - it tends not to come out cleanly - squeaks and squawks. Not sure if this is specific to this particular sax - have others had this problem?

  6. #306
    Distinguished SOTW Coffee Guru milandro's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vibratosax user experiences

    Hi Edwin , the D2 is a complex note in many saxophones (brands and types) and in general small leaks higher up tend to show up there and in the famous low C gurgle (which can be caused also by a less than ideal fitting to the " cork" ) . The inconsistency between registers can be due to a less than ideal match between mouthpiece and horn.

  7. #307
    Forum Contributor 2012 edwin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vibratosax user experiences

    Hi milandro,
    Hmm, well there could easily be a leak - I had to adjust some obviously out-of place components when I got the horn and it's quite possible there's something just a little out of whack that I missed.
    I remember D2 being an issue when I started (due to the player and not the sax), but for at least a couple of years now I haven't had any trouble with this on my other saxophones. So I think it probably is the sax. Guess I should take it to my tech and see what he finds.

    Now you mention it I have read about problems like this with mouthpiece/horn mismatch. I'd thought it was more of a vintage sax issue? Nothing exotic about a Meyer 5M. What mouthpieces have others tried with the A1S? Is it mouthpiece-sensitive in others' hands?

  8. #308
    Distinguished SOTW Coffee Guru milandro's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vibratosax user experiences

    matching a mouthpiece to a horn is a thing that can happen as much with new horns as with older ones and more so if the horn is of a design that is less that common. this could be at the base of some, shall we call them intonation peculiarities observed in the early stages of the Vibratosax life and that I have no reason to think have disappeared (even though they have improved some of the mechanical problems of the beginnings).

  9. #309

    Default Re: Vibratosax user experiences

    Quote Originally Posted by edwin View Post
    For me, with a Meyer 5M mouthpiece, the answer on the vibratosax A1S turns out to be "not much at all" i.e. I need the mouthpiece pushed in a long way to get G1 (concert Bb) in tune.
    Hi Edwin,

    The reason I was asking is that when I use my Vibes Sax Partner (big white plastic mute enclosure) I have to put the cork part of the neck of the A1S through the neck hole in the mute, so I can't push the mouthpiece down onto the last half inch of cork - the neck behind the cork is too wide for the hole in the mute. I've no idea if it needs to be pushed down that far to be in tune but if it does, I'm kind of stuck. Originally, I was asking about the stock white plastic mouthpiece but now I'm using a Yamaha 4CM (ebonite version of the 4C).

    I have an electronic tuner I could try. It's just meant for strings, I think, but I suppose it would work. I'm still confused about what note I'm supposed to be tuning to though, as notes don't have the same names on a sax as they do on the tuner.

  10. #310

    Default Re: Vibratosax user experiences

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy A1S View Post
    I have an electronic tuner I could try. It's just meant for strings, I think, but I suppose it would work. I'm still confused about what note I'm supposed to be tuning to though, as notes don't have the same names on a sax as they do on the tuner.
    Saxophones are what are called 'transposing instruments,' meaning that the notes that they play are transposed from concert pitch. The key of the instrument is what Concert pitch is played when the instrument plays a C on it's respective scale. For example, alto and bari are E-flat instruments meaning that if you play a C on your alto, its Concert Pitch equivalent will be Eb. Tenor and soprano are Bb instruments, meaning a C played on tenor will be a Concert Bb.

    Alto ==> Concert (tuner)
    F ==> Ab
    F# ==> A
    G ==> Bb
    C ==> Eb

    Those are the notes my professors/ensemble leaders used to tune the band most often. My sax prof for sax ensemble had everybody play an F on their horn, making a Concert Eb-Bb 4th/5th. I'd go with F or G, and as your ear and playing get better you'll be more able to adjust other tuning issues on the fly. Some other issues that will arise for you: the longer you play at one time the warmer your horn will get, changing the intonation (sharper); as you develop, try to keep your embrouchure consistent through all levels of the horn - you might be tempted to bite harder on the upper notes or drop your jaw on the lower; and lastly, your mute case will affect your intonation. I have one, and it really kills the lower register. Granted, mine is probably about 10 years old, so they may have changed something between then and now.

    Good luck!
    Soprano - Antigua Winds 590-BC JodyJazz Classic 8-3/4 (refaced by Paul Coats), Lavoz Medium; Rascher, Legere 3-1/4, Francois Louis lig
    Alto - Yamaha YAS-875EX, black lacquer JodyJazz Classic 9, Legere Studio Cut, Rovner Dark lig; Rascher, Legere 3, Francois Louis lig
    Tenor - Yamaha YTS-62 JodyJazz Classic 12, Legere Studio Cut, Rovner Dark; Rascher, Legere 3-1/2, Francois Louis lig

  11. #311

    Default Re: Vibratosax user experiences

    Thanks, Eulipion2. I'll try that.

  12. #312

    Default Re: Vibratosax user experiences

    This is Vandoren Jumbo Java with Fibracell medium reed.

    http://youtu.be/CoPe9gWB2p0

  13. #313

    Default Re: Vibratosax user experiences

    The same mouthpiece with Legere reed 2.5

    http://youtu.be/NV1h1nrY0PY

  14. #314
    Forum Contributor 2012 edwin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vibratosax user experiences

    Just to add to Eulipion2's answer to Andy's questions - I doubt you will need to push it in right to the end of the "cork" and anyway it probably doesn't matter if you are a little flat when practising with a mute, being in tune with an external standard is only essential when you are playing with others. You do want to aim to be in tune with yourself, of course (i.e. the notes are consistent up and down the range of the horn). And your guitar tuner should be fine, taking eulipion2's comments about transposition into account.

    Thanks for the links vibratosax, will check it out when I get home.

  15. #315

    Default Re : Vibratosax user experiences

    Thanks to everybody for this interesting thread and to the people for buying, checking, testing, playing this new product. After having read all the comments, looking for information about reeds, I found a video on the Vandoren website with Claude Delangle a classical teacher speaking about reeds, mouthpiece, and playing his alto sax. Just listen to the difference. I know it’s not the same topic. But it’s worth to click, listen, and have a little of his philosophy…

    Sorry, unable to display

  16. #316

    Default Re: Vibratosax user experiences

    Quote Originally Posted by edwin View Post
    Just to add to Eulipion2's answer to Andy's questions - I doubt you will need to push it in right to the end of the "cork" and anyway it probably doesn't matter if you are a little flat when practising with a mute
    Okay. Thanks, Edwin.

  17. #317

    Default Re: Vibratosax user experiences

    I haven't read all of this thread, but I'm very surprised at the amount of people buying saxes unseen.

    My tactic when buying a sax is to spend at least 20 minutes on the horn, have a friend there to listen to it, try out a couple of horns and so forth. I'd say it was essential for an inexperienced player to take along someone who can play, or even better, pay a good repairman to go with you.

    If I took the gamble of buying ANY sax through the net I'd expect to have to spend at least 30 of our British pounds on a set up.

    Here's a story - I was buying a cheap soprano made in the far east once in a respected shop in England, and noticed that there was something iffy around the G area, so quizzed this. On further inspection it turned out that about an eighth of one tone hole was covered with what looked like a film of lacquer, which was then simply removed in the workshop. A novice wouldn't have noticed it, and their playing would have been altered at the outset if they hadn't been wise enough to take it to a good repairman.

    So it is very worthwhile taking brand spanking new saxes to a trustworthy repairman for a check straight away.

    Sure, I've heard a lot of new yanigasawas work straight out of the box, but I'd sooner hand over extra money to find out that one was ok. I'm of that generation of players who grew up with leaky and faulty saxes, and need a second opinion.

    My repairman says the only safe way to ship metal saxes is to crate them, and he thinks that the vibrato could develop sticky pads. But the horn looks like a highly interesting development, and a baritone version would be even more interesting than a tenor.

    Eeee, I remember when you could get a grafton for 15 pounds! (though no one would repair it for you, flowerpot saxes we used to call them).

  18. #318
    bluemike's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vibratosax user experiences

    Hi,

    coming back to mouthpieces again: Rico Graftonite B or C work fine. Metalites in my opinion just don't sound right on the Vibrato. As if the energy of the metalites is absorbed somewhere.
    Quite different with Vandoren Jumbo Java, which also have a high baffle: they literally can scream (on every horn though). But the Javas are not really meant for beginners. Check out the Rico Graftonites. They work with the Vibrato. The A1 and A1S respond a little more to different mouthpieces than other contemporary horns.

  19. #319

    Default Re: Vibratosax user experiences

    Hello, I was posting my first intro in the indroduction thread.

    Hello, My real name is Pollapak but you can call me Puck.

    We are USA importer of Vibratosax, please feel free to send me message if you have any question regarding the Vibratosax. our website is http://vibratosax-usa.com

    Also I am located in San Francisco.. and would be more than happy to meet to show and let you have a go on the sax anywhere in the Bay area... info@vibratosax-usa.com

  20. #320
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    MartinMusicMan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vibratosax user experiences

    Puck - I'll be in touch. I'd love to try out a vibratosax.
    The Martin "Official Music Man" tenor, Barone black tenor, The Martin baritone, Richards Martin Indiana alto, cheap Chinese soprano, Metalite mouthpieces, Plasticover reeds, Nord Electro 2, bunch of other instruments
    Wall Of Blues, youtube video, P-Town All-Stars, get Rich, Cannons (my band in the 60's) and Cannons record

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