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Brian Powell Refaced Mouthpieces: Why do so many players resell them?

41K views 96 replies 54 participants last post by  tomsch 
#1 ·
Like many of you I often browse ebay and SOTW for vintage Otto Link tenor sax mouthpieces and invariably a high percentage of the ones you see have been refaced by x, y or z refacer. But it seems like in the last year or so I've seen more and more pieces refaced by one Brian Powell up for resale. And from the descriptions you can tell that most of the sellers are players--many of which even say they were the ones who requested and paid for the refacing services.

So my question is--after going to the time and expense of sending a piece to Powell and waiting for it to come back for who knows how long, why would they turn around and resell it?

The only conclusion I can reach is the Powell-refaced piece didn't do it for them for whatever reason (i.e. did not meet their expectations).

In contrast, it seems like there are some refacers whose work you rarely see--names like Jon Van Wie come to mind here. And when you do see one the description usually says something like the piece only had one owner--the guy who had it refaced--and that he used it as his main piece for 15 years, etc. I recently saw an ad for one of Van Wie's pieces with similar verbiage, and the seller added that the only reason he was selling it for the original owner was because the guy had retired from playing and needed money for his retirement home or something.

There are other people whose pieces you also see up for resale a lot too, but Powell's refaces seem to be flooding the market lately.

As a result, I have decided that I wouldn't take a chance on his pieces since so many other players have obviously unloaded them.

So who has played Powell-refaced pieces and if so, did you order them or someone else? And do you still own it or did you resell? And if you resold it, why?
 
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#2 ·
Thats too bad that you've come to that conclusion for yourself.

I have had mpc's refaced by almost every known refacer from Florida to Italy----and Brians work is my favorite.




He makes every single piece play way better than how it was when i sent it to him.....and I mean 100% of the pieces.

I am extremely happy with my personal playing mpcs for alto and tenor, and I deal mpcs---so every one I get in here is for sale.

My tenor piece is a slant sig refaced by Brian, and it absolutely kills.



As the biggest vintage mpc dealer out there, I try to sell the best playing mpc's---Many vintage mpcs that come through here, dont play well when I get them. I have tried nearly everyones work and Brians work from a playing perspective, is 2nd to none. His work is also very clean, which makes them easier for me to sell.



Why others sell their pieces that Brian has redone...I dont know?

Not everyone is going to love Brians work, or everyones work for that matter. Its all subjective. You certainly should try out his work before deciding its not worth the chance for you.


I love his work and think he is the best of the best!

When I need mpc's refaced, i send them to Brian, because I find his work to be outstanding.



Others whom I've gotten pieces from that have played well: erik greiffenhagen, mojo, freddie gregory, theo, eric falcon, bob carpenter, adam niewood, norbert stachel, ted klum, rafael navarro, ed z, doc tenney, andreas riss, john reilly, john yoakum, marin spivak, william garcia, and many more. These are all very good refacers, and if you dont dig what brian does to a piece---try one of these guys.
 
#5 ·
tenor man...at the end of the day ,us saxophonists are diseased individuals who are convinced we need another mouthpiece.....and as you look at your shelf you figure,hey i dont need this old one anymore........so you sell anything......just to feed the monkey
.....uhhh you got any for me??
 
#6 ·
First off Jon sadly was not with us all that long so his overall numbers of refaces were not that many, I had some work done by him, he was outstanding.

Brian's work is outstanding, he recently tuned up a favorite mouthpiece of mine that I wanted darker.

But I feel the answer, no matter who has refaced a mouthpiece, is that a large majority of (student, casual and semi-pro) players really don't now what they want in a mouthpiece or how to achieve what they want. They always want to sound "like somebody" and they think they can achieve that by subscribing to the mouthpiece of the month club.

My concept came from a good friend, Dexter Gordon, who told me back in the early 70's "you can't even begin to get all the sound you can from a mouthpiece until you've played on it for at least a year" and truer words have not been spoken!

JR
 
#8 ·
But I feel the answer, no matter who has refaced a mouthpiece, is that a large majority of players really don't now what they want in a mouthpiece or how to achieve what they want.

JR
Yes, this is 1000% true no matter who is doing the work. Managing expectations can be the toughest part of the craft.

I think it would be a mistake to draw a conclusion like this from a forum such as this...

Brian's work is awesome.
 
#7 ·
I think maybe you might be drawing a false conclusion form your observations. BP has refaced thousands of pieces and in my experience he is so good that many players send him multiple pieces to reface. If they are like me, when they get the pieces back they choose their favorite and sell the rest. I've probably had Brian do at least 20-30 pieces for me. All of them were great except for two I didn't like very much. I sent them back to Brian after telling him what I didn't like about the pieces and he worked on them again. Both pieces played perfect when I got them back. Now here's the thing, of those 20-30 pieces, I have 3 left. The rest I sold. They were great pieces but I kept my favorite.

The tenor pieces I have are a florida link that was a Theo Wanne 7 that I bought from 10Mfan. It was killer but the 7 was too small for me so I had Brian open it to 8. Now it felt to big. I had him close it to 7*........perfect. I've been playing that for about a year.

The other tenor piece is a EB link that I had JVW work on. To be honest I never liked it too much after JVW worked on it. It played OK but I felt like he took some of the sizzle out of it. I sent it to BP to reface. I could have kept it and sold it for a ton but I wanted to play it. Brian did the job.......it plays great now.

The reason you see so many BP pieces is because he has done so many. I wouldn't know the number but JVW isn't with us anymore and his pieces are much more rare. Those that have them probably don't want to sell them because they will be worth more in the future and you can't get another one.

All this being said, I have never played a bad BP piece. If I see that in the sale ad it attracts me even more to it because I know it will play.
 
#14 ·
I have never played a bad BP piece. If I see that in the sale ad it attracts me even more to it because I know it will play.
Same here. Since I'm not a "collector," I often wonder why mouthpieces in "original" condition tend to sell for more than refaced pieces (and in this case, BP refaced pieces). Assuming it's a quality refacing job, you know the piece will play much closer to its full potential. A good refacing job is what we all wish they had taken the time (with the requisite skill) to do to the piece in the first place.

I know there are more than just a few great refacers out there. In my experience, none are better than Brian Powell.
 
#9 ·
Some folks are always going to be looking for the next thing; whatever that may be. Some folks are always going to promote that next thing; whatever that may be. The power in obtaining that thing (whatever it may be) often seems to transcend reality when basic truths are twisted and denied by not only the promoter, but the seeker as well who has bought in. In such cases the seeker can then become a promoter, but without remuneration; held captive by the lie in serving their master.

But in this case... I'm sure it's just fickle mouthpiece hunters moving from one to the other.
 
#10 ·
I'm not giving up my BP refaced link anytime soon. I bought it from another member that had had Brian reface three links, and he kept the one he liked. I think he gave up the wrong one.:)
 
#11 ·
Just about everybody sells everything eventually. Brian does a lot of work...Im guessing a whole lot. To see turnover does not mean a person found the piece problematic. While I dont know that sax players are "Diseased", we all joke about the turn over of gear by our use of the term GAS. If you saw Brian's work selling for 35 dollars on a refaced piece maybe then you could start to wonder. His pieces hold their value quite well. The majority of players who have refacing work done already know that they are unlikely, in most cases, to fully recover the cost of the piece and the full cost of refacing (unless of course it's the hottest new mouthpiece trend or the big 4...Meyer, Link, Selmer, Berg).

BTW: I am not friends or affiliated with Brian. He is (according to some views) "competition" but the way I view it is that he is a man who has earned great respect in the music world and there are more than enough mouthpieces in the world to reface. He cant do them all and neither can I. Give the guy his dues :mrgreen:
 
#20 ·
Brian's work is fantastic--and the same goes for Adam Niewood and Doc Tenney, as well as my friend James Bunte. If someone sells something that doesn't work for them, it's not necessarily a reflection on the work--and that is particularly true in the case of experienced and highly reputable craftsmen like Brian. Far more likely is that the seller was expecting some characteristics that were simply outside the design intent of the piece, and are selling it to raise funds for the next stab in the dark. If there are many examples of Brian's work on the market, it's because his work is sought after--and for good reason. Market observations are an exceedingly poor way to judge someone's work. If you're curious, try his work.
 
#21 ·
Hi,

All I can say is that Brian's work is just perfect. Very neat work, outstanding finishing, great and kind attention and the most important: the refaced mpcs do the job. For me a refaced piece by Brian is a guarantee, I know it will work fine.

I have some pieces worked by BP.
I had two Floridas wich didn't work, then I asked to two SOTW members who was the best refacer to do the work and both of them told me: BP. I got back the two mpcs, one of them was really good (one of the best pieces I have in my drawers), with the other one I felt some resistance and I found it a little bit stuffy. I sent it back to Brian some time later (I have very little free time and I was clearly late, no problem at all with Brian) with other pieces. He tweaked it again at zero cost (despite the long time from the first refacing) and now I don't know wich is better.
He also worked on a tenor Lawton wich is fantastic and some legit pieces wich I still haven't tried enough due to free time (I must concentrate in my current projects), but finishing is just perfect.

The only negative thing is the long waiting list due to the big amount of work that Brian has, but .......... this also means that lots of people trust on Brian's work, and this is an excellent sign.

Cheers!!!!
Anselmo
 
#31 ·
I dont call people who do that opportunists. To me that has a negative connotation. Frankly, if you have a vintage piece and your going to have it refaced with the possibility of future sale it makes sense to hire someone who knows the work and is is not Joe Somebody down the street. These "Opportunists" are customers. They pay to have work done and they spread it across the planet when they sell their pieces. While mouthpiece work is a craft and an art, it is also a business and there is nothing wrong with that. I have certain customers I know are going to sell the pieces I make and I really dont care. I just hope my work eventually ends up in the hands of someone who really enjoys it. They help pay the bills which allows me to keep doing what I do.
 
#36 ·
I've had only one piece that was refaced by Brian - an RPC 115B. I sold it because, quite frankly, I was afraid that I was going to hurt somebody by playing it. By the way, is he related to Brian Piccolo ?
 
#37 ·
I've had few mouthpieces worked on buy a couple of guys out there and this is obviously something very personal for all of us who play the saxophone. Mouthpieces respond differently and we all have a different opinion as to how they should help us play. I really like both Mojo's work and Brian Powell's work. They are both very nice people, very responsible craftsmanship and the finished work Brian did on my Sugal KWII puts my Guardala in the second place spot. So, I guess we'll all just keep searching for more and more gear and sometimes have some of it tweaked just for fun. Best wishes, Mikey
 
#38 ·
I dont call people who do that opportunists. To me that has a negative connotation. Frankly, if you have a vintage piece and your going to have it refaced with the possibility of future sale it makes sense to hire someone who knows the work and is is not Joe Somebody down the street. These "Opportunists" are customers. They pay to have work done and they spread it across the planet when they sell their pieces. While mouthpiece work is a craft and an art, it is also a business and there is nothing wrong with that. I have certain customers I know are going to sell the pieces I make and I really dont care. I just hope my work eventually ends up in the hands of someone who really enjoys it. They help pay the bills which allows me to keep doing what I do.
I suppose I referred to those mentioned as "opportunists" because that word doesn't have a negative connotation to me, quite the opposite, usually. To put it in my perspective, I personally would be much more confident buying a Powell, Erik G, Mojo, Phil-Tone, (insert next talented refacer here), etc. refaced piece than just about any stock piece. I have a lot of respect for you refacers out there, it is a skillful craft dedicated to helping the customer achieve the most they can get from their mouthpiece.
 
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