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Thread: Buffet Crampon Serial Numbers

  1. #1

    Default Buffet Crampon Serial Numbers

    Hello,
    I recently purchased a Buffet R13 and I was trying to research the serial numbe, which is 36794. When I enter it into the the serial number finder on Buffet's website it says it was made in 1985.

    The clarinet professor at the school I attend says its much earlier than 1985, and when I did further research, I found a few sites that said from 1945-1957 all the serial numbers of the horns made in this period were lost. From the serial numbers from the years before and after this period it seems that my clarinet falls into this period of lost serial numbers.

    That being sad can anyone help me confirm or negate my findings? Was my clarinet made in 1985 or earlier?

    Thanks

  2. #2

    Default Re: Buffet Crampon Serial Numbers

    It was made much, much earlier than 1985. I have a 96,XXX made in the sixties.

  3. #3
    Distinguished SOTW member/Official SOTW Sister bandmommy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Buffet Crampon Serial Numbers

    Check out the serial # list at clarinetperfection.
    You may be able to get an idea about the 'real' date of manufacture there.
    Old reed players are like fine wine. They only get better with age. Tom Hagen

    Play the Music, not the instrument.

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    Default Re: Buffet Crampon Serial Numbers

    It predates the R13s

    My 1955 R13s, which were the official first year of production are 51xxx and 55xxx

    Check this section out, and check the visual identification of your clarinet.
    http://www.clarinetperfection.com/cl...Identification

    This is a full serial number range
    Your serial number is around 1948 - 1950 I would guess, which would predate the R13s
    http://www.clarinetperfection.com/cl...t.htm#BuffetSN

    Buffets website only goes back to around 1959

  5. #5

    Default Re: Buffet Crampon Serial Numbers

    Ok, wow. Thank you so much for all of your help (thats to everybody). It seems like I have a pre R-13, which I think is cool. Or at least I hope it is. When I bought it I thought it was a regular R-13 and the guy who sold it to me honestly thought so too. I don't know much about these pre R-13's. Is it worth keeping. For me it plays nice and sounds nice so I guess I will keep it. Are these considered to be worse or about the same as an R-13? I ask all these questions because I am really a sax player learning to double and brand new to the clarinet world.

  6. #6
    Forum Contributor 2012 Chris J's Avatar
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    Default Re: Buffet Crampon Serial Numbers

    First thing is that the pre R13 instruments are not worth as much as an actual R13, so you may want a conversation with where you bought it, depending on how much you paid for it. If it was sold to you as an R13 at an R13 price, then it has been misrepresented (albeit in innocence)

    As for the quality - others know better than me. There are significant bore differences. There are keywork differences. When it comes down to value for money, then a pre R13, at the right price, can give you excellent value. Of course , so can an actual R13 give excellent value for money, but more money!
    Chris

    Tenor: Couesnon Series II Monopole; Barone V7*; Vandoren Java #3
    Alto: Couesnon Series II Monopole; Barone J6M; Vandoren Java #3
    Alto: Yanagisawa A-600 (Vito VSP); Otto Link slant sig. (Wolfe Tayne face) 5*; Vandoren Java #3
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    Clarinet: Bb Leblanc Opus; Morgan RM15; Vandoren "56" #3
    Clarinet: Bb Evette & Schaeffer (Buffet E13 1961); Selmer C85/120; Vandoren "56" #3

  7. #7

    Default Re: Buffet Crampon Serial Numbers

    ok. i purchased it for $900 (USD). I thought I was getting a good deal for an R13. Is this not so much a good deal for a pre R13?

  8. #8
    Forum Contributor 2012 Chris J's Avatar
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    Default Re: Buffet Crampon Serial Numbers

    It depends on its condition.
    See the link below:
    http://www.clarinetperfection.com/ClarinetValue.htm
    Chris

    Tenor: Couesnon Series II Monopole; Barone V7*; Vandoren Java #3
    Alto: Couesnon Series II Monopole; Barone J6M; Vandoren Java #3
    Alto: Yanagisawa A-600 (Vito VSP); Otto Link slant sig. (Wolfe Tayne face) 5*; Vandoren Java #3
    Soprano: Buescher TT (1926); Barone V7; Vandoren Java #2.5
    Clarinet: Bb Leblanc Opus; Morgan RM15; Vandoren "56" #3
    Clarinet: Bb Evette & Schaeffer (Buffet E13 1961); Selmer C85/120; Vandoren "56" #3

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Buffet Crampon Serial Numbers

    Quote Originally Posted by mattimus9 View Post
    ok. i purchased it for $900 (USD). I thought I was getting a good deal for an R13. Is this not so much a good deal for a pre R13?
    What you paid for it used is probably more than twice what it sold for NEW.
    My old clarinet teacher has a 1961 R13 that he purchased new for $600.
    Old reed players are like fine wine. They only get better with age. Tom Hagen

    Play the Music, not the instrument.

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    Default Re: Buffet Crampon Serial Numbers

    Pre-R13s on eBay were regularly gonig for the mid $400s
    R13s will go for at least about $900 on ebay
    assuming no repais to each

    In a online store or retail store you can basically at least double the price for the selling price after a full overhaul and warranty.

    The pre R13s are very nice instruments. They blow a litle easier in a way than the R13s and generally (when setup up properly) have very good tone. These were the top of the line Buffet rpo instruments back then.

    now, loosely speaking, in the university setting with professors and all, they generally sell them for more than the gonig ebay rate. They seem more akin to price comparison to the retail pricing of things, so they generally sell instruments for more money. Their instruments are usually in very good repair too and can be reviewd, playtested, etc before purchase.

    So ... comparison-wsie .. if you went he ebay route you would pay say $500 for one. Then have an overhaul done for at least $250 then a total of say $750 or more (top notch retail overhauls can cost upwards to $700). Compare that to the $900 price you paid and it all depends ....

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Buffet Crampon Serial Numbers

    Quote Originally Posted by bandmommy View Post
    What you paid for it used is probably more than twice what it sold for NEW.
    My old clarinet teacher has a 1961 R13 that he purchased new for $600.
    now that is a good price for an R13 !!
    but what that the 1961 price he paid for it ??

  12. #12
    Distinguished SOTW member, musician, technician & columnist clarnibass's Avatar
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    Default Re: Buffet Crampon Serial Numbers

    Quote Originally Posted by bandmommy View Post
    What you paid for it used is probably more than twice what it sold for NEW.
    My old clarinet teacher has a 1961 R13 that he purchased new for $600.
    I don't think it's really possible to compare prices like this. So to mattimus9, don't be confused by this post and think that an old clarinet must sell for less than when it was new. Prices changed drastically since then. I recently sold my R13 for more than what I paid for it new in (if I remember correct) 1991. It was still only about 50% of the price of a new one today.

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Buffet Crampon Serial Numbers

    Quote Originally Posted by stevesklar View Post
    now that is a good price for an R13 !!
    but what that the 1961 price he paid for it ??
    Purchased brand new in 1961 for $600.

    And clarhibass, I didn't mean the OP was ripped off.
    I was only trying to make a statement that prices of clarinets today are very different than what they were a few decades ago.

    One of these days I'll learn to just keep my mouth shut.
    Old reed players are like fine wine. They only get better with age. Tom Hagen

    Play the Music, not the instrument.

  14. #14

    Default Re: Buffet Crampon Serial Numbers

    sweet. this is some great info. thank you so much. i understand what you all are saying about prices changing over the years, and what ive concluded from what you all have told me and from looking at that chart on clarinetperfection, it seems that i have over payed a bit. if the clarinet had been overhauled and was in pristine playing condition with new pads and what not, i would say i payed what i needed to pay. the pre R13 I have needs some repadding and key work which was not included in the selling price. the clarinet itself does play well and sound well and would be worth keeping (I think) if i can get some money back or have an overhaul done for the price i payed. but i will take that up with the guy i bought it from, who did honestly make a mistake and thought it was an R13 and wasn't trying to rip me off. thank you again. i really really appreciate your input and help.

  15. #15

    Default Re: Buffet Crampon Serial Numbers

    I paid $320 for my top of the line R13 in 1969 ( I was in jr high school and it was my complete life savings from years of mowing lawns and shoveling snow). I haven't played on a clarinet mouthpiece costing less than that for years.

  16. #16
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    Default Re: Buffet Crampon Serial Numbers

    I have this price list from 1982 which was put together from a Woodwind mailling and a NEMC catalog. (this is WoodWind before it became WW & BW .. they marketed them separately back then it seems). You can see the retail and the mail order prices. back then it was more taboo to order mail order .. and look where we are at today.
    http://www.clarinetperfection.com/clPriceList.htm

  17. #17

    Default Re: Buffet Crampon Serial Numbers

    haha wow. that is too funny. how i wish those prices still held today. im sure the popularity of the R13s really cranked up the price as well as inflation. i actually don't like mail ordering instruments because its easier to try them in a store. however, here in nashville we don't really have any good horn/instrument stores (other than drum and guitar stores) so i have used wwbw's instrument trial program a few times. still not as good as being at a store tho

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Buffet Crampon Serial Numbers

    Sticker price for the standard R-13 in 1955 was $325.00. (both A, Bb and also Eb). Full Boehm ( model R16 3/4) was $465.00. As they added features (eg and articulated G#, model R13 1/2) they would increase the model no.

  19. #19
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    Default Re: Buffet Crampon Serial Numbers

    Quote Originally Posted by spike421 View Post
    Sticker price for the standard R-13 in 1955 was $325.00. (both A, Bb and also Eb). Full Boehm ( model R16 3/4) was $465.00. As they added features (eg and articulated G#, model R13 1/2) they would increase the model no.
    I've been curious about that. I have two 1955 standard boehm models. a 55xxx which cost me $800 several years ago and a 51xxx which i got for free in a way.

  20. #20
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    Default Re: Buffet Crampon Serial Numbers

    Quote Originally Posted by stevesklar View Post
    I've been curious about that. I have two 1955 standard boehm models. a 55xxx which cost me $800 several years ago and a 51xxx which i got for free in a way.
    Mine is also 55XXX. I also have golden era (late 60's early 70's) which is a very different horn. I much prefer the 50's horn. The later model is stuffy by comparison and , to my ears, the sound is very different.

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