Cheap Bari anyone?

[GlasgowBop]

Trying to get hold of a bari.

A guy who playes a suzaphone (King - made out some to white material) told me you can get bari saxes for about a grandfrom china. Apparently, there are some really good machine made models on sale?but i haven't found it easy to find on the net. Anybody got any ideas?

[Chris Peryagh]

There's a Yamaha 32ish copy from Gear4music at around £800:
http://www.gear4music.com/Woodwind-B...music-Gold/78B

And a bronze bell one at Packers for just under £1000:
http://www.johnpacker.co.uk/instruments/101629.htm

[Pete Thomas]

really good machine made models on sale

I don't think there is such a thing as a machine made saxophone, they are mostly hand made.

I'd steer clear of the inferior ones.

I did get a very good and surprisingly cheap bari (a Walsein Bauhaus), that is absolutely amazing, I use it now for pro TV and film session work.

Here is a soundclip:

[JayeSF]

There's a guy on eBay US selling a nice old Buescher Harwood stencil for under $500 usd....Can't imagine it'd cost $500 usd to get it shipped/fully insured US Post international priority to Scotland...probably would be more like $400 or so. He says it fully plays and has been serviced, too.

Much better alternative to a crappy chinese horn.....

[cpete]

JTm0UtPqjGA[/YOUTUBE]

That really is impressive Pete, no sh*&

[Pete Thomas]

He says it fully plays and has been serviced, too.

Many people on ebay say that! On ebay you often need to factor in a ull overhaul and possibly repairs on top.

Much better alternative to a crappy chinese horn....

But I'm not talking about a crappy one, I'm talking a bout a pro quality saxophone.

[Conrado]

really good machine made models on sale

I did get a very good and surprisingly cheap bari (a Walsein Bauhaus), that is absolutely amazing, I use it now for pro TV and film session work.

Here is a soundclip:

Pete - That was an awesome performance and love that bari tone.

[Pete Thomas]

Pete - That was an awesome performance and love that bari tone.

Thanks everyone, it's funny though when I went to buy that horn I tried three different ones, I wasn't sure about this one as it seemed to be mellower in the upper register, I wasn't sure if it was something wrong or just the way that particular horn was, I mean all saxophones are different. The other two seemed more like normal baritones, by that I mean they sounded very much like Yamahas or Yanagisawas. To this day I still wonder whether I should have go one that is brighter in the upper register, but to be honest, I find that brightness something I can add by blowing. It's harder to get a brighter horn to sound mellow so I decided to stick with it.

Plus, I still have my Martin, though the intonation is not as good.

[jmathesonjr]

My experience with the Chinese made off brand horns is that they make better lamps than musical instruments. Some sound great. The problem is when a repair needs to be made and the horn will not accept the repair or will get worse after the repair. Some, for example, do not take soldiering very well or do not hold shape once a dent has been pulled. Most of the Chinese models have a life of around six months to a year before things start falling off and bending.

I have stated here many times that a Baritone Saxophone is not a cheap investment. You may find one cheaply priced, but repairs and maintenance costs are higher for a bari. Reeds, mouthpieces, cases, stands, neck straps are higher priced than alto or tenor saxophones. Baris are harder to maintain, I feel. They are bigger and do not handle the minor dings and dents like the alto and tenor.

If you find a bari for under $500.00, you did great. Just do not be surprised when you may have to put in another $100.00 - $250.00 for a mouthpiece, $40.00 for five reeds, $300.00 - $1,000.00 for a new case, and $1,000.00 - $1,200.00 for repairs because that cheap bari needs dents pulled and new pads.

i bought a new Yamaha 62 17 years ago. I paid $3,900.00 for it then. I bet I have put another $10,000.00 into it since then with just repairs (two major repairs), cases (two in 17 years), mouthpieces (I have bought six mouthpieces in the 17 years), ligatures (two in 17 years) and straps (six in 17 years). Add in the reeds and it might be $15,000.00. I have this horn checked every year to 18 months for adjustments and never leave with paying less than $100.00. The average is around $175.00.

In short, a cheap bari is a fallacy.

[cpete]

Ok at this point someone has to say this, if you list the good ones, and list the bad ones, you will likely find your chances of getting a good Chinese horn aren't bad at all, more decent horns by far than bad ones these days.

[kcp]

Wow! Nice performance Pete. I like it even better than that other one you did on tenor.

[Chris Peryagh]

The Bauhaus Walstein bari is mostly Yamaha with bits of Selmer and Yanagisawa baris thrown in.

http://woodwindandbrass.co.uk/acatal...saxophone.html

But it is £1500.

[JayeSF]

He says it fully plays and has been serviced, too.

Many people on ebay say that! On ebay you often need to factor in a ull overhaul and possibly repairs on top.

Much better alternative to a crappy chinese horn....

But I'm not talking about a crappy one, I'm talking a bout a pro quality saxophone.

Oops, Pete...I wasn't referring to your previous post or your suggestion particularly...just referring in general to those folks who feel their only choices are contemporary low-budget instruments....

And actually, Pete, I disagree with you on your first point...my experience has been if a sller says it's been serviced and plays up and down...it indeed...does. But not many sellers actually flat-out say it clearly, they use iffy semantics which leaves them wiggle-room to esape afterwards. THIS is when you get screwed. When a seller with good feedback and a history of selling horns says she's setup to play, she very often is....

[JayeSF]

Ok at this point someone has to say this, if you list the good ones, and list the bad ones, you will likely find your chances of getting a good Chinese horn aren't bad at all, more decent horns by far than bad ones these days.

....not for under a grand....for a Baritone fer' sure not...

..for under (or at) a grand......or even a tad over a grand...you are seriously handicapping yourself if you try to buy a new baritone....what you will end up with is...a cheap chinese horn.

So, you can make the jump to 1250-1500 pounds and then start moving into the territory Pete suggests...

(although I would argue that really, for 1500 pounds budgeted for a Bari... rrrrreally.....you can get a poppin' pro vintage player which would be significantly more horn for the money).

So, Glasgow, bump your budget up to 13-1500.....or...

stay in the 900-1100 zone (which is absolutely NOT an unrealistic budget to have these days) and get a good, solid vintage/used horn (and still have the money left to ship it and get some work done on it if needed).

[ansyf125]

I have a late 12M that I might be willing to let go of for one g. I'm still undecided.

[Morry]

I played a generic Chinese one that my dealer friend had in his store. Surprisingly nice horn for $1800 to $1900.

[Mal 2]

Here is a soundclip:

AHA! So I'm NOT the only one who uses the right thumb for side key trills!

Nice sounding horn, and the intonation seems as good as you say it is. I just think that horn would look REALLY good with your purple jacket, and it's a shame you didn't wear it for the video!

[stitch]

If you're quick: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Baritone-Saxop...d=p3286.c0.m14

[DavidW]

That one looks nice, but I am not sure that is the original lacquer, especially since it is in a replacement case. If it was re-lacquered, it doesn't appear to have been buffed very much.

[clarnibass]

There's a guy on eBay US selling a nice old Buescher Harwood stencil for under $500 usd....Can't imagine it'd cost $500 usd to get it shipped/fully insured US Post international priority to Scotland...probably would be more like $400 or so. He says it fully plays and has been serviced, too.

I'm not sure about Scotland but if it's anything like here (and probably is for shipping from USA) then to ship a baritone in a reliable way is definitely expensive, and then there is VAT to pay on the entire sum i.e. including the shipping cost (here it is 16.5%, don't know about Scotland). Some extra fees might be necessary too depending on the situation. Not that it's impossible or necessarily a bad idea, but just things to consider before ordering.

my experience has been if a sller says it's been serviced and plays up and down...it indeed...does

although I would argue that really, for 1500 pounds budgeted for a Bari... rrrrreally.....you can get a poppin' pro vintage player which would be significantly more horn for the money

Here is a story of what happened to a local player.

He couldn't find what he wanted locally for a price he wanted (only special order), so he ordered used from eBay. He got an older model for about 50% of the price of the current model from the same company. The seller seemed very reliable and the instrument was supposed to be in very good playing condition and look almost like new.

After a much higher price than the actual sale price (because of shipping, tax, etc.) the saxophone arrived. It looked almsot like new. It was in about reasonable playing condition. It wasn't in very good playing condition. The problem it had were small by themselves, but to fix them required a lot of other things to be fixed too, so it's not so cheap. Basically it is needed to press some keys slightly more than optimal condition to play. So in the end it wasn't exactly as described (which to me = non or very little repairs are necessary to make it in best condition possdible).

But, the main thing is, he doesn't really like it that much. He tried many mouthpieces, bought the best one he found (which already was a huge improvement). Tried many different reeds. He came to the conclusion that although it's not a bad saxophone, he just doesn't really like it.

Returning it is practically impossible. Selling it locally might be possible, but very difficult for near the total price he paid for it, and no one would buy it before trying it themselves. Selling it won't help that much either, since then he is again stuck without it or a replacement.

Price (i.e. what you call "more horn for the money") was definitely part of the reason he bought it. But that didn't matter. It was a lot more horn that he didn't want. If he could go to a local store to try an instrument, or find a local used instrument and actually try it, and decide he likes it, he would definitely pay (even significantly) more for it. In the mean time, he (a bit relunctently) accepts it and plays this instrument. Pretty much all a result of trying to get "more horn for the money" which unfortunately had to ceom instead of actually choosing the instrument.

I'm sure there many cases where none of this happens, I even know of some of them (even a student of mine got a great and cheap instrument from eBay, total of about 1/3 of what he would pay here). But this is all worth considering. I also bought a few instruments from USA without trying them, and coincidence or not, with none of them I was as happy as with instruments I chose myself (which for me happened to be at a store). Paying more for them is completely overshadowed by this, there is no comparison. It is so easy to save on many other things like car, TV, etc. but maybe I live in an imaginary bubble where musical instruments is exactly not where I would try to save.