Weird finish on 10m

[EsbSpecial]

I have a 10m, serial # 309xxx (1940-41) that has an odd lustre to it. The horn was certainly relacquered at some point in its life as the engraving is fairly shallow, but that isn't the odd part. In the area surrounding the engraving (standard lady in the pentagon) and in spots on the bell there seems to be a very distinct silver undertone. The left hand stack shows the same, with a milky silver being almost the dominant tone. The keys seem to share the same properties, with the silver undertone particularly present near the touches. I know that many 10ms from this serial range were silver plated, but why the hell would anyone lacquer over it? Are my suspicions of having a silver plate horn underneath the "paint" justified? I have a local vintage horn guy giving it a once over starting tonight so hopefully he can offer insight too.

The other oddity of this horn is that it has two names engraved on it. I am assuming one of them is the musician who used to own the horn, with the second name being that of the horn itself (us musicians are odd like that). I haven't been able to find any information on either name and was wondering if anyone else has...

The names on the horn are "Freddie Real" and "Yvonne Lopez." Both appear to be done by the same person at what I can only assume was around the same time.

I was hoping to find out some to the history behind this horn and try to figure out how it wound up at a ****** music store in New Hampshire of all places...

Thanks in advance!

[Grumps]

I know that many 10ms from this serial range were silver plated, but why the hell would anyone lacquer over it?
Once lacquer became mainstream, many old horns were refinished to perhaps match other horns in sections, or for ease of care. If your horn was simply lacquered over the silver plate (and this isn't too uncommon), than you are lucky indeed, as all you'll need to do is strip the lacquer. Now of course gold plated horns had silver underneath as well, but you seem to rule that out. Just make sure it's truly silver underneath, and not just shiny brass.

[EsbSpecial]

I am hoping that Vintage Horn Guy I Am Sending The Horn To tonight will be able to tell me more about just exactly is underneath the lacquer.

If it really doesn't effect tone (which I have been told it does/does not, depending on how correct the person wants to make themself sound), I was thinking of leaving it as it is, and polish the horn up to a T. Hopefully the polishing would let the parts where the silver is coming through show more and basically make the horn even more different looking than the Selmer SA-80IIs, VIs and Yamaha 62s I share sections with.

[EsbSpecial]

Once lacquer became mainstream, many old horns were refinished to perhaps match other horns in sections, or for ease of care. If your horn was simply lacquered over the silver plate (and this isn't too uncommon), than you are lucky indeed, as all you'll need to do is strip the lacquer. Now of course gold plated horns had silver underneath as well, but you seem to rule that out. Just make sure it's truly silver underneath, and not just shiny brass.


This horn is almost certainly not gold plated. It is almost definite lacquer oversomething....I compared it side-by-side with a 6m ser# 295 that is all stock, and there is definetly more than one layer of finish on this horn.

If it is silver and the plating is in good enough shape to warrant a stripping, I may have that done on the body, but leave the keys as they are....who knows!

[bruce bailey]

Is the body mostly satin? That would also confirm it was silver plated. You may be a lucky chap on this one. All that would be needed is a chemical strip and polish.

[EsbSpecial]

Is the body mostly satin? That would also confirm it was silver plated. You may be a lucky chap on this one. All that would be needed is a chemical strip and polish.

I'll throw a couple pics on this afternoon before I send it off, even though I am unsure if they will show what I mean.

How could I tell if it was satin? As of now it just looks like flat lacquer with silver undertones in spots.

EDIT: Got some photos. The camera was dying, but these are the best I got. Hopefully they show what I mean.

[Hornlip]

That looks like lacquer over non-satin silver plate to me, unless it's over nickel plating.

[EsbSpecial]

That looks like lacquer over non-satin silver plate to me, unless it's over nickel plating.

Nickel was Finish 61, and there weren't a whole lot of those produced within teh serial range of my horn. Odds are it is silver plate.

The guy working on my horn said that he wasn't going to touch it only because he doesn't have the resources to do it RIGHT. I like him already.

Plus, he let me honk out a little on his vintage axe. Wow. I have never played a tighter horn. I can't wait to get my horn back.

Would you get it stripped down if you had this horn, or leave it as is?

[DavyRay]

I think I would leave the finish as it is. If you get it put into playing condition, just put some time in and get to know it. I think you will learn more about it by living with it. If the keys have no silver on them, but the body does, what would that look like if the body was stripped? You can decide those kinds of things over time.

If you like it, just play it. It is certainly unique.