Suggestions please??

[andrezzz]

I'm currently at a roadblock as to how to manage my tone. I do long tones and stuff but I still feel like theres something missing. I am convinced it is my mouthpiece/reed combination. I have a Meyer 5M mouthpiece. I'm playing with Vandoren V16 reeds. I'd describe my tone kind of sharp and edgy, but I'd much rather have a smooth, rich, flowing sound. Any suggestions as to what reeds I should try out?

Thanks.

[Sasquatch]

All of them. Seriously.

http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l196/cox_d79/SeriousCat.jpg

[Gizmo Hall]

I'm currently at a roadblock as to how to manage my tone. I do long tones and stuff but I still feel like theres something missing. I am convinced it is my mouthpiece/reed combination. I have a Meyer 5M mouthpiece. I'm playing with Vandoren V16 reeds. I'd describe my tone kind of sharp and edgy, but I'd much rather have a smooth, rich, flowing sound. Any suggestions as to what reeds I should try out?

Thanks.

I'd say that you should maybe try something like the Vandoren ZZs. To me, at least, they curb the brightness on my pieces. I'd also suggest a different mouthpiece (then again, I'm not too much a fan of Meyers). I like the Selmer Soloist series. Usually they give me a big fat tone, as opposed to the bright razory sound of my BARI WTII.

[gary]

I don't mean this negatively, but really this thread shouldn't go much further until you've tried out a variety of reed makes/types. You mention only one reed and that's not enough to go on.

Also, there's no reason you shouldn't have the kind of sound you describe with a Meyer 5M. I played on all last year and you could use the same description of my sound as you are looking for. I would add, though, that I think the Meyer 5M produces a somewhat bright sound.

[Jeff C]

you need to try:
LaVoz
Rico jazz Select unfiled
Alexander NY

[A_SaX]

Don't know if you buy your reeds in lots of 10 or whatever but do try that next time (buy a whole pack). Soak them in water for a few seconds, and then try and play full range with each one... you'll notice not all play the same. Sometimes we try to play on reeds where V16 #1 doesn't do much for us, but V16 #2 sounds phenomenal. I use the traditional Vandoren reeds and I have to say, only like 1-2 I find are satisfactory in a pack of 10. Do you find you have a lot of resistance when playing? You could be trying to make a reed play that wasn't meant to be played by you! I know... funny thought, but go through a whole pack just to see how different each one plays.

[martysax]

Are you an Alto player?

I played a Meyer 5 on my trusty Mexiconn 7M alto, as seen in my current avatar ca.1978, for 26 years. I always got the best results with LaVoz mediums or Medium Hards. When I switched to Dukoff, I switched to V16s, like on my wife.

[mattp169]

I will second teh call to try Vandoren ZZ. If you like V16s but there's something missing ZZs are a good place to go. The other 3 choices I would recommend would be Vandoren Java, Alexander Superial and Alexander Superial DC

[BYOB]

Maybe your Meyer 5M just doesnt work well with your sax.

With my 82z, it's strangely quite resistant (doesnt matter strength of reed) and the best I can do with it is a harsh, edgy tone. However, on something like a Yas-23 or any other student horn for that matter, it has a very smooth, somewhat edgy tone. I like it on other horns, just not my own.

[mattp169]

BryanQ You should try a Morgan 5E similar design but not as edgy, plus different rubber and hand facing make it very smooth and much less resistant.

[GaithersburgReeds]

A...I switched to V16s, like on my wife.


Same ligature?

[andrezzz]

One more thing to add guys. I'm only 15 so I don't have any income, and my parents aren't rolling in cash either. So I can't be buying a bunch of different reeds or mouthpieces all time. The Meyer is my only mouthpiece, and I only buys reeds every few months (whenever i run out). So anyway, there's the response to the "try everything before posting" replies. Thanks to the people who gave the suggestions so far.

[bari_sax_diva]

andrezz... what kinds of playing do you do? That is, besides in your practice room... do you play in concert bands, big bands, or what? If you're in a legit setting you can probably go pretty far on your current setup, but I might suggest looking at something else if you're playing in, say, a loud big band.

[mattp169]

Ok giving that money is tight and your 15. Here is the best suggestion I can give you. Since you are use to playing on Vandoren reeds I would stick with the Vandoren's first. There is a significant difference in the sound one naturally produces using all 4 versions of the Vandoren reeds. Check out by calling every store within conceivable driving difference to you. And ask them if they sell Vandoren 1 reed at a time. Vandoren now sells the 30 packs of all 4 versions of their sax reeds. These 30 packs are designed to allow retail stores to sell one reed at a time. So more stores are selling Vandoren reeds in singles instead of a box of 10 only. If you can find a store that does sell them in singles try and get at least 1 if not 2 of whatever size reed you use now in the Vandoren Java, ZZ and traditional. This will cost you more per reed but you could conceivably spend less than $20 and get 2 of each version of the 3 Vandoren reeds. Then you can try all three without buying a box of each. Then if you do find a store in your area to do this at, ask them also what other reeds for alto they sell in singles, if they sell one son this list of suggestions and you can afford it pick those up at the same time. So get on the phone and do a little calling to see if you can find a places. Hopefully you can find one that sells stuff in singles. Otherwise, I don't know if any of the store owners who post here sell reeds in singles but maybe they can help you out and ship you some.

[andrezzz]

andrezz... what kinds of playing do you do? That is, besides in your practice room... do you play in concert bands, big bands, or what? If you're in a legit setting you can probably go pretty far on your current setup, but I might suggest looking at something else if you're playing in, say, a loud big band.

I play in my high school concert and marching bands.

[E7sus4(b9)]

......or, rather than focus on equipment, how about focusing on how you can change to change your sound? Probably one of the best ways to get a richer, more fluid sound is to transcribe a lot. Get a really good model of sound in your head and do whatever it takes to replicate that sound and feel exactly with your saxophone -- with your current equipment.

Personally, I go through phases of sound models and my sound changes a little with my current obsession. Right now, for me, my man is Sonny Stitt. I am currently transcribing some of his solos (memorizing -- not writing down) and trying to sound exactly like him in regards to tuning, articulation, phrasing, and especially sound. I have also done this with Dexter Gordon, Coltrane, Joe Henderson, Eddie Daniels, Bob Mintzer, and many others -- all using one set-up. I have been playing more alto lately and so, I'm also transcribing some solos (Stitt for now) on my alto with the same set-up I've used for over 20 years (meyer 6m and java 3's).

This forum can be great for advice about what is good equipment, but if you try to follow everyone's equipment advice, you'll either run out of $$ fast or go completely nuts -- or a little of both, I guess. Try changing you first. This takes a little longer, but the payoff is much greater. It will make you a more versatile player, it will give you a richer sound, and you will have more sounds and styles at your disposal for any situation. Then, once you've exhausted everything you can do to change your sound and there is still "something" missing, try some other equipment.

I hope you find this advice helpful!:)

[Zannad]

Someone's already suggested to try them all...I totally agree with that!

There is no way a reed will perform in the same way on different setups...your oral cavity for example differs from anyone else, so it's up to you.

I read some criticism against the Plasticovers (in term of tone)...when I tried them I was left speechless by the difference they bring as I finally got that gripping grasping sound I was looking for (metal mouthpiece size 8 + Plasticover 1.5).
Now, I'm serching for the right combination with harder reeds...(still looking).

[andrezzz]

......or, rather than focus on equipment, how about focusing on how you can change to change your sound? Probably one of the best ways to get a richer, more fluid sound is to transcribe a lot. Get a really good model of sound in your head and do whatever it takes to replicate that sound and feel exactly with your saxophone -- with your current equipment.

Personally, I go through phases of sound models and my sound changes a little with my current obsession. Right now, for me, my man is Sonny Stitt. I am currently transcribing some of his solos (memorizing -- not writing down) and trying to sound exactly like him in regards to tuning, articulation, phrasing, and especially sound. I have also done this with Dexter Gordon, Coltrane, Joe Henderson, Eddie Daniels, Bob Mintzer, and many others -- all using one set-up. I have been playing more alto lately and so, I'm also transcribing some solos (Stitt for now) on my alto with the same set-up I've used for over 20 years (meyer 6m and java 3's).

This forum can be great for advice about what is good equipment, but if you try to follow everyone's equipment advice, you'll either run out of $$ fast or go completely nuts -- or a little of both, I guess. Try changing you first. This takes a little longer, but the payoff is much greater. It will make you a more versatile player, it will give you a richer sound, and you will have more sounds and styles at your disposal for any situation. Then, once you've exhausted everything you can do to change your sound and there is still "something" missing, try some other equipment.

I hope you find this advice helpful!:)

great advice, thanks. I just recently started transcribing a kenny garrett solo, and well now i know I'm on the right track.

[E7sus4(b9)]

great advice, thanks. I just recently started transcribing a kenny garrett solo, and well now i know I'm on the right track.

Way to go! I would also recommend that for amazing alto sound concepts you check out Sonny Stitt, Cannonball Adderley, and Phil Woods. There are approximately a ga-zillion others I could list, but that's a pretty good starting place. Kenny Garrett's playing is amazing - one of my absolute favorites, but for someone just starting out, his playing can get a little tricky to transcribe.

Remember, try to copy exactly what these players are doing -- intonation, articulation, phrasing... EVERYTHING. Be very picky. When you are playing along with the recording, play as if you are playing 2nd alto in a sax section and the recording is the lead alto. Try fitting into or blending with the sound on the recording and don't try to over blow or overpower the recording. It's also very helpful to record yourself playing along with the recording so you can listen back to hear if you are matching exactly.

Give it a little time and I am certain you will notice some changes in your sound.

Happy transcribing!:)

[Roger Aldridge]

Andrezzz,

The Meyer 5M that you're talking about, is this a Babbitt Company Meyer rather than an old Meyers Brothers mouthpiece? I don't remember exactly when Babbitt took over Meyers but I suspect it was some point in the 70's. The point about this is Babbitt Company Meyers are not the same as the old ones. The old Meyers were fantastic. One of the WORST experiences I had with a mouthpiece was with a current production Babbitt Company Meyers. There are several refacers who take a new Meyer and reface it so it has the facing measurements more like an old Meyers.

With this in mind, it's possible that there could be some problems with your mouthpiece. There are a number of good mouthpiece refacers on the forum (like Ed Z., Mojo, and Brian Powell) who could check it out and see if it needs any adjustments.

Another option is to try a Morgan M....which is closest to an old Meyers. I'd suggest a 6M or 7M. The suggestion to try a Morgan 5E is way off the mark. It's the brightest Excalibur model made by Morgan. It's not even close to a Meyer. If you have a chance to try several Morgans, I'd suggest a 6M and 6L as good ones to start with. JunkDude.com now has a return policy. This could enable you to try several Morgans and if you don't like them send them back for a refund.

Good luck!

Roger

[andrezzz]

Andrezzz,

The Meyer 5M that you're talking about, is this a Babbitt Company Meyer rather than an old Meyers Brothers mouthpiece? I don't remember exactly when Babbitt took over Meyers but I suspect it was some point in the 70's. The point about this is Babbitt Company Meyers are not the same as the old ones. The old Meyers were fantastic. One of the WORST experiences I had with a mouthpiece was with a current production Babbitt Company Meyers. There are several refacers who take a new Meyer and reface it so it has the facing measurements more like an old Meyers.

With this in mind, it's possible that there could be some problems with your mouthpiece. There are a number of good mouthpiece refacers on the forum (like Ed Z., Mojo, and Brian Powell) who could check it out and see if it needs any adjustments.

Another option is to try a Morgan M....which is closest to an old Meyers. I'd suggest a 6M or 7M. The suggestion to try a Morgan 5E is way off the mark. It's the brightest Excalibur model made by Morgan. It's not even close to a Meyer. If you have a chance to try several Morgans, I'd suggest a 6M and 6L as good ones to start with. JunkDude.com now has a return policy. This could enable you to try several Morgans and if you don't like them send them back for a refund.

Good luck!

Roger

I'm assuming my Meyer is not a Meyer Bros. one, since I bought it less than one year ago.

[martinm5862]

I play in my high school concert and marching bands.

Most concert band players would consider the Meyer too bright and are more likely to use Selmer S80, C*, with Traditional Vandoren or V16.
mm

[gary]

Regarding modern Meyers methinks the reports of their death are a bit premature. If one plays several one should be able to find a good one. If you don't trust me, ask the Old Mouthpiece Doc. If anyone should know he does, and he has opined that reports of their lack of quality are greatly exaggerated.

[cfile]

I bought one of these for my daughter when she was in high school and she never liked it for anything but marching band. I played it for a while and found it played well, but was a little bright for my taste; I preferred an older Brilhart which required a lot less work to get a tone that would blend with other horns. When I did play it, I preferred the Java reeds which I thought were a little easier to control than the V16s. With #3 Java's and a mic, it would compete with electric guitars. Hope this helps.