Anyone tried the Gear4Music Bass Sax?

[Johnmcd]

Hi,

Gear4Music is a UK based company that is selling Chinese made instruments at incredible prices (a tenor sax for £225/$450). I've read reviews elsewhere on this forum that actually rate their saxes very highly - they're solidly built, not at all flimsy, all equipped with the full range of keys (front F and high F# etc), and pretty well in tune (apart from the terrible plastic mouthpieces that they supply with them, but then I think most people would experiment with different pieces for a new sax and not stick with the one that came with the instrument). They also keep going too, unlike a lot of student horns that start to fall apart after a few months.

I've recently noticed that they're now selling a Bass Sax for £2,500 (about $5,000 at today's exchange rates). I'd love to know if anyone has tried it. I wonder if their quality of manufacture extends to the larger instruments (I recently bought a low C bass Clarinet from them which I had to return with their very handy 14 day money-back-guarantee, as it just wasn't sturdily enough made). Perhaps they're able to produce the larger saxes with the same sturdiness as the smaller ones.

Apologies if there is already a thread going on this, but I'd love to hear what people think of these. If you can be bothered to put some brief strain on the credit card, it's almost worth getting one and returning it for full refund in 2 weeks, just to try it out.

http://www.gear4music.com/Woodwind_Instruments/Saxophone/Bass_Saxophone_by_Gear4music_Gold.html

Cheers all,

John.

[Dave Dolson]

John: if you read through the bass sax section you will see previous discussions about Asian-made bass saxophones.

I don't know about this specific model in the Gear4Music ad (I looked at the ad), but I'm guessing that not many places are making (or assembling, who knows?) new bass saxophones. If I were a betting man, I'd bet that the one you are considering is essentially the same thing as the model being offered by International Woodwinds.

I've seen them in person - and listened to one of the two models played by the guy running the IW booth at a huge trade show in Anaheim, California. The one I saw played had a huge voice, just like the old Conn/Buescher models from the '20's. It looked just like them, too, complete with the old split bell pads. It boomed as the guy played it.

At this year's show (search for posts about NAMM), IW added a different kind of bass sax, one modeled after the Selmer MKVI. They were side-by-side. The Selmer was obviously a different horn (smaller over all) and if consistent with the few Selmer basses I've heard before, most likely weaker than the vintage-style bass sax. The Selmers I've heard just sounded like lower baritones - no BOOM in the tone.

I have heard unsubstantiated talk about how the IW basses are not as well made as the old Conns and Beuschers, but it was second-hand talk and who knows how biased the story teller(s) may have been about Asian saxophones. Hope this helps. DAVE

[Chris Peryagh]

I'm about to take delivery on the Gear4Music bass http://www.gear4music.com/Woodwind-Brass-Strings/Bass-Saxophone-by-Gear4music-Gold/8FB, so I'll post my findings on here once I've given it a go.

Shame they only offer the one type (by JinYin) - I would prefer the SA80II copy (by Jinbao) as it sits much lower to the ground and has the modern style keywork (bell keys on the right) but could do with a metal thumbhook instead of the plastic one, but a relatively inexpensive (I won't use the word 'cheap' as it's just under £2800 including around £7 postage through FedEx which is good) bass shouldn't be sniffed at if it delivers what a bass sax is meant to deliver.

I expect it won't be perfect and will need a fair amount of tweaking, but for a bass well under £3000 as opposed to upwards of £12,000 - which one would you choose if you don't get the opportunity to play it too often (but have it there for when you do)?

In the meantime, here's some music (with plenty of bass sax in it): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZANKFxrcKU

[SaxPlayer1004]

I've played the Selmer styles quite a bit and according to a couple good sources there's two factories making the basses in China. One making the American style the other making the French style. The French style is great. I got plenty of "boom" out of it with a baritone Link STM. The keywork is fantastic and the intonation was spot on. The American style had the same keywork and intonation issues as the vintage ones IIRC. With the right mouthpiece and right player you can get plenty of oomph out of the Selmer wraps

[Chris Peryagh]

I've played the Selmer styles quite a bit and according to a couple good sources there's two factories making the basses in China. One making the American style the other making the French style. The French style is great. I got plenty of "boom" out of it with a baritone Link STM. The keywork is fantastic and the intonation was spot on. The American style had the same keywork and intonation issues as the vintage ones IIRC. With the right mouthpiece and right player you can get plenty of oomph out of the Selmer wraps

Will the Buescher-style one take a bari mouthiece? I know most basses can use bari mouthpieces so I hope the crook is narrow enough for one.

[SaxPlayer1004]

It took my STM, but that for some reason has a bored out shank. I think it may have been altered by Paul Coats to be a bass piece, the window looks a bit bigger than normal

[Chris Peryagh]

It took my STM, but that for some reason has a bored out shank. I think it may have been altered by Paul Coats to be a bass piece, the window looks a bit bigger than normal

If my Lawtons don't fit, I could try an older Berg Larsen ebonite as they have a larger diameter bore.

[VintageSaxGuy]

As the owner of a Buescher True Tone bass, it would be interesting to some day compare mine with one of the new 'American style' bass saxes (which are essentially copies of a True Tone). I saw a bass for sale a little while back that was supposedly the sax used to design the new asian basses. They said part of the deal involved them receiving a new bass for free in return for letting the company use the sax...what he/she said was that the newer sax was heavier and wasn't nearly as resonant.

If that's true or not...I do not know. But I do know that quite a few people who review the new saxes don't have an older bass, or haven't had significant playing time on one (IE, played consistently for more than just a few days), so they may not have a solid point of comparison when saying the new copy is worse/good/better compared to the original.

But at that price, even if the tone isn't quite the same...it's still a good value for a bass. If I wasn't such a vintage nut (and didn't already have a bass), I would be seriously considering one of these since the only other options for basses are in the $15,000+ price group.

[SaxPlayer1004]

liberal cork grease for lubrication, but remember to use a johnny
:twisted: if it's tight, just use more cork grease

[Chris Peryagh]

liberal cork grease for lubrication, but remember to use a johnny
:twisted: if it's tight, just use more cork grease

Yeah - best to promote protected sax in this day and age.


I wonder how easy it'll be to convert the top coil to make it more like the Selmer wrap (with the crook sitting much higher)? Making the U-bend will be the tricky part.

[Gandalfe]

I wonder how easy it'll be to convert the top coil to make it more like the Selmer wrap (with the crook sitting much higher)? Making the U-bend will be the tricky part.Look at the "How it's made - Trumpets" vid on uTube. They fill the part to be bent with a soap and water mix, freeze it and then bend. That keeps the tube from collapsing and bending unevenly. Very cool actually.

[Chris Peryagh]

Look at the "How it's made - Trumpets" vid on uTube. They fill the part to be bent with a soap and water mix, freeze it and then bend. That keeps the tube from collapsing and bending unevenly. Very cool actually.

Only problem with this U-bend on bass saxes is the diameter - and also the physical strength needed to bend such a wide diameter of (tapered) tubing full of frozen soap solution into such a tight U.

[DavidW]

Use a pipe bender maybe (like muffler shops use)?

[Chris Peryagh]

Use a pipe bender maybe (like muffler shops use)?

I think I'll leave it as is - no point in mucking around with something for the sake of it if it works fine (and the 8ve mechanism will have to be altered as well).

The problem with U-bends is getting the length of them right and also the length of the straight sections of tubing. The Selmer bass also has the shorter main body section when compared to the tall basses.

[Chris Peryagh]

Got it delivered this morning and it's what I expected - the general solidity of construction is great in the bell and other body sections are all solidly fixed in place and don't move, but it does have the usual sloppy and overbroached keywork and pillar heads, as well as some unlevel toneholes (the G# being the worst, but I'll take a tonehole file to that).

It comes with two crooks, one is too loose in the socket and the other is too tight. I haven't tried my bari mouthpiece on it yet, but the mouthpiece it comes with appears to be a bari mouthpiece.

But these things can be sorted out easily enough (if you have the time, equipment and know-how), so I'll go over it soon enough to make it more playable.

[Chris Peryagh]

Fettling done, bell screwed back on, new waterkey nipple made (the original one was just an 8ve vent which protruded into the bore!) keywork refitted and it's not a bad instrument - certainly not perfect by any means (what do you expect?), but it plays easily from low Bb to top F (there are some stuffy notes in between) and the shorter crook certainly helps with the tuning as the longer crook is a shade on the flat side. Standard bore bari mouthpieces fit on both crooks, so Selmer, Yanagisawa, Vandoren, Lawton, Dukoff, Yamaha, Link, etc. bari mouthpieces will be fine with it.

But at least there's a choice of crooks to use, and now I've fitted the short crook (which was really tight) I can safely say I'd use it on a job - whenever one comes along.

[Palomorado]

I can safely say I'd use it on a job - whenever one comes along.

Just MAKE a job for it!
When my buddy got his vintage Conn Bass we made a band that specialized on LOW instruments:

-Bass Sax
-Tuba
-Baritone Guitar
-Double Bass
-Congas (still looking for BASS congas, :doubt: )

Just make sure people know you have a Bass sax and people will also just realize that they "need" one!

[VintageSaxGuy]

Glad to hear that the sax is working out with a little tweaking!



Just make sure people know you have a Bass sax and people will also just realize that they "need" one!

It's really sad but I haven't had luck with people wanting, let alone needing a bass sax...that doesn't stop me from 'surprising' them by bringing it anyway! You could always start another bass sax quartet like Deep Schrott.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1cma-l8wS5A

[Palomorado]

There has been at least 5 times when my friend and I are walking around NYC and someone sees the bass sax gig bag on his back and has asked him to come play!