Martin prices

[Stencilman]

Just received my Martin Handicraft Alto stencil thinking I stole it off of Ebay for $280. Other than pads, it is in like-new condition.

I was surprised to review past auctions that most Martins sell for just $200 to $300 with the exception of "The Martin Alto" and "The Martin Tenor" which have brought in $650 to $900. Can someone tell me why these particular horns are so much more valuable?

My two favorite altos that I've owned were "The Martin Alto" and an early Selmer MKVI, but this Handcraft is possibly the best playing alto I've ever tried. Even with the original pads, it beats the pants off my MKVI in projection and tone. I expected a sweet, subdued sound but this thing can wail. It can accept a huge amount of air without backing up. The tuning is pretty good, too.

I'm just surprised that even with a good overhaul, it may only be worth $300 on Ebay.

[BigDaddyJ]

ssshhhhhhhhh........ More fun for the Martin fans!

[Stencilman]

Yeah, I try not to comment on my Ebay "techniques" and experiences or I'd just be inviting competition.

Really, I'm not complaining that Martin's are going cheap, just wondering why.

[garyinla]

In general, 1920's horns are worth much less on the open market today than later model horns.

I think there may be some justification for this. In general I think 1920's horns have smaller bores than later horns.

If you look at Martins, I believe the THE MARTIN has a larger bore than the earlier 1920's Martin Handcraft models and also than the 1930 Martin Committee and CommitteeII.

Bigger bore means bigger sound I think.

I think this was an evolution of design of the saxes over the years, and how they fit into popular music.

But I have played the Typewriter model and also the Handcraft Imperial and it is my impression those horns have a pretty big sound too. I could be wrong but I wonder if the bores of the Typewriter model, the Handcraft Imperial, and also the very last Handcraft models before the Handcraft Imperial model, ie serial no. over 9x,xxx, before the Handcraft Imperials came out (about 110xxx?), could possibly be larger than the later COmmittee and CommitteeII models.

The Handcraft Imperial may have been made at the same time as the CommitteeI model. I wonder if they may have been marketed for different purposes.

Also I wonder how the bore size of the THE MARTIN compares to the Mark VI and Mark VII, where it fits in, in comparison.

Also I wonder if there was a change in bore size during the run of the THE MARTIN horns, because the earliest ones seem to play and feel a little thinner in bore size I think.

[DirkW]

Martins in general are undervalued. They always have been and most likely always will be. I can only guess that it's a combination of no big names having publicly played them (that I know of) and the fact that usually the intonation is sketchy.

To answer the original question, its often "buzz" that drives up the prices. Everyone loves to gush over the Mark VI, so they command the highest prices. An alto Yani 901 has almost identical tonal qualities and more accurate intonation for a fraction of the price.

That said, I agree (again) with garyinla. The Martin XXX has a larger bore and a bigger sound. They subtone like no other horn I've played.

I sold a The Martin Tenor 193,XXX on eBay for $2250. It was in rare condition and had a fresh overhaul. The winning bidder had inherited a The Martin Tenor from his uncle and played that horn for years. He sold his Martin to buy a Mark VI, only to discover that The Martin has the better tone.

I paid $950 for a The Martin Baritone (sight unseen) that was beat up, bent body, bad repairs, and needed a repad. After another $300 in repair, I now have a killer sounding horn. But it's still ugly as sin. I doubt I'll ever be able to sell it for the money I've put into it, but I don't care. I'll likely keep it until I'm too old to play it.

[SteveZ]

I have a Martin committee 1 searchlight tenor that's got the most killer subtones i've ever heard on any horn, ever. and the intonation is very good. the sound is absolutely unique, from the top to bottom. it's got a very husky, open sound that projects like the dickens. i don't think i'd get what i think it's worth if i sold it, but i ain't selling. it just sounds too wonderful.


i think good condition, original laquer "The Martin"s sell for a good amount, but they're the only ones that'll fetch a worthwhile price. Older ones like mine don't seem to command as much, even in superb condition. I think it's because they don't fit the traditional sound parameters that all the masters made famous. Players have a certain sound in their head that they want to emulate, and you just can't sound like that with an old Martin.

But when i want to sound really different, i'll break it out and play my pants off.

[paulwl]

I've got a fantastic gold-plated 1930 Typewriter alto that would have cost me $400 more if it weren't a Typewriter, $600 more if it weren't a Martin, and $1,200 more if it were a Selmer. People don't know what they're missing...:)

[brentb]

I got my The Martin Tenor (187xxx) sight unseen for just under $1000. After playing it a few weeks to make sure I knew how the mechanics were, I gave it to my tech to work on. $107 later, this is a different horn, and much improved. It was certainly playable before the tuneup but had several quirks. If I had been able to see this horn in person prior to purchasing it, my offer would have only been about $800 tops. I can't complain, because now the horn plays great and I'm enjoying it too much to really care.

From my searching, other The Martin Tenors prepped for sale are running over $1500 -- some over $2000 -- and many in the $1700-$1800 range.

[garyinla]

SteveZ, dont assume the sound people have in their heads is not the Martin sound.

[paulwl]

Maybe he's differentiating "people" from "players." Or "players" from just players...

[paulwl]

[pre-"The" Martins] don't fit the traditional sound parameters that all the masters made famous.
Ah, now that might be my problem...I don't give a cold noodle about the traditional sound parameters. :wink: I wanna cut when I wanna cut, and whisper when I wanna whisper, and the Typewriter seems to do both quite nicely (tho it's not my main horn). The goofy keywork doesn't get in the way much, either, actually.

[SteveZ]

paulwl,

you just made my point. our old Martins DON'T sound like anything else. and i like it that way. :wink:

my passing point was that it's very hard to copy the tone of, say, Stan Getz or John Coltrane or Hank Mobley or any of the selmer crowd with a Martin. But for those who want to create their own sound, they're wonderful.

I use both a committee 1 and an old Keilwerth New King--both are very different from each other, and from anything else. I constantly get positive comments on my tone. my chops are another matter. but that ain't the horn's fault. :roll:

[CashSax]

I've tried 4 The Martin tenors and they just don't ring my bell..Ebay's got my best and last one for auction now and it's not bringing what I thought it would..nicely re-lacquered but not buffed, crisp sharp engraving and a fresh quality full-tilt o'haul..the thing looks and plays like a brand new horn..but SLOooooowww action so far.. :roll:

[Martin]

could it be you are asking too much?
or is it just that some people don't like relacquered horns?

[CashSax]

Could be Martin, although re-lac is not necessarily the end of good horn as many players well know..but unfortunately the mere word scares most folks off..I've owned both, and this '55 The Martin Tenor I currently own(back on Ebay Btw..) easily plays and sounds the best of the 4 I've owned. The other 3 were in original finish.One was chem stripped bare, One Silverplate and the other an original lacquer..I've lowered my reserve price twice, but I won't give the horn away as IMHO one day these horns will go up in price..Look at the 10M's ..I paid 100.00 for my first 10M, nowadays a good one can bring 3 grand.. go figure.?? My TH&C Tenor I got for 3K a couple yrs back is now bringing 5K at Charles Fail..I've always paid top dollar for a horn that I wanted badly enough, but buying the best has proven to be smart, as virtually all my tenors are appreciating in value and have proven to not only be great players but great investments as well.. :wink: