The perfect 45-player ensemble?

[JfW]

Okay, this topic is completely trivial and invented only to pass the time awaiting the Thanksgiving holliday. Yet, I'd thought it would be nice to inquire opinions as to what the perfect instrumental balance would be for a group like a community or non-proffesional band. Of course, in a proffesional ensemble or orchestra this balance is a dictated one and one can choose the number of trumpets one employs, but notso in a volunteer group.

This query is in no small part inspired by my own musings concerning the abundance of a certain instrument in my community band and how such hypothetical changes could be made to bring a better balance. It assumes no real difference in playing abilities of different sections.

here's what I came up with:


Sop Clarinet: 7
Alto Clarinet: 1
Bass Clarinet: 1
Flute/Picc: 7
Oboe: 1
Bassoon: 1
Alto Saxophone: 2
Tenor Saxophone: 1
Bari Saxophone: 1

Total woodwinds: 22

Trumpet/cornet: 6
Fr Horn: 4
Trombone: 3
Baritone/Euphonium: 3
Tuba: 2

Total Brass: 18

Total Precussion: 5

whaddya think?

[tubbycub]

You might want to consider the following whenever possible:

- add a couple more clarinetists since their parts tend to emulate the string section in an orchestra
- add another trombonist, so that there are 3 tenor trombones and 1 bass trombone
- 1 of the clarinetist to double on the Eb clarinet
- add a 2nd oboist who can double on the English Horn
- 1 of the alto saxophonist to double on the Soprano
- add a string bass who can double on the electric bass

With this setup, you will have the ultimate symphonic band and you will have all the crucial instrumentation to play any kind of music. Just my 2 cents, happy Thanksgiving!

[beth]

my wind ensemble at school consists of:

1 piccolo
4 flutes
2 oboes
1 english horn (most of our pieces had seperate eng. horn parts...this isnt feasible in a community band though)
6 Bb clarinets (wind ensemble setting, its nicely balanced - symphonic band would have more)
1 Eb clarinet
1 bass clarinet
1 contra bassclar (bass clar when no contra part)
1 alto/sop sax
1 alto sax
1 tenor sax
1 bari sax

6 trumpets
4 horns
3 tenor trombones
1 bass trombone
2 euphs
2 tubas

1 string bass

6 percussionists, 1 doubling on piano (were fortunate to have a piano/percussion double major)

i feel its a perfect balance...

[JfW]

You might want to consider the following whenever possible:

- add a couple more clarinetists since their parts tend to emulate the string section in an orchestra
- add another trombonist, so that there are 3 tenor trombones and 1 bass trombone
- 1 of the clarinetist to double on the Eb clarinet
- add a 2nd oboist who can double on the English Horn
- 1 of the alto saxophonist to double on the Soprano
- add a string bass who can double on the electric bass

With this setup, you will have the ultimate symphonic band and you will have all the crucial instrumentation to play any kind of music. Just my 2 cents, happy Thanksgiving!

Doubling to English Horn, SopSax, Eb sop clarinet would work, but Given my (artificial) limit of 45, what instruments would you suggest I replace/reduce to add another trombone/bass/soprano clarinet?

I allready see a bit of a weakness in the middle voices and a bit of a shortage in precussion. If I had ten more players to work with, I'd probably worry more about adding more esoteric instruments.

[tubbycub]

It also depends on the repertoire you are using. If you want to play very general pieces like those written for junior bands and earlier band works, your initial orchestration was good enough. But if you want to play those recent works from composers like James Barnes, Alfred Reed, Johann De Meij etc, additional instrumentation is required.

The additional trombonist is quite important since you are concerned with the 'weakness' in the middle voices. But bear in mind that a strong brass player can outblow a flute or clarinet anytime. I have seen too many bands where the woodwind section cannot be heard at all as they have been drowned by the brasses.

Given your limitation of 45 players, perhaps you can:

- take away one of the flutes
- forget about the 2nd oboe/cor anglais since there are cue notes written for other instruments
- do away with the string bass player

[Merlin]

3 Flutes (at least one doubling picc)
2 oboes (one doubling E.H.)
2 bassoons
1 Eb clarinet
6 Bb/A clarinets
1 alto clarinet
1 bass clarinet (pref. to low C)
1 contra clarinet (pref. BBb to low C)
1 soprano sax
2 alto saxes
2 tenor saxes
1 bari sax
1 bass sax

3 cornets
2 trumpets
4 horns
3 trombones
1 euph
2 tubas
1 string bass
4 percussionists, with at least one doubling piano

Of course, I've always claimed that you could play just about anything written for band with minor adjustments to orchestration by writing for: woodwind quintet+brass quintet+sax quartet (w/WW doubles) string bass and 2 percussionists.

17 players altogether. No conductor.

[Vortex]

Why not just model it after one of the army/navy/air-force bands? They get the best of the best, so I'm sure they've put a lot of thought into what kind of ensemble they want.

[gary]

Why not just model it after one of the army/navy/air-force bands? They get the best of the best, so I'm sure they've put a lot of thought into what kind of ensemble they want.

Good suggestion. Here's the answer to that, though. It really depends on the band director and what s/he sees as the function of that ensemble, so the resulting instrumentations are actually somewhat varied .

Well - reading the above one can see that philosphy has a lot to do with instrumentation. My ideal would have the capability of playing most traditional and contemporary band music but with the flexibility of performing jazz, pop, folk influenced and other category-less musics:

1 picc.
3 flutes
2 oboes (E.H. double)
1 bassoon
1 Eb clar
9 clarinets
1 Bb bass clar

2 alt saxes (sopran double)
2 ten saxes
1 bari sax

5 trumpets (3 cornet/2trpt or all trumpet parts)
4 horns
4 trombones
1 euphonium
1 tuba

1 keyboards (incl. string ensemble*)
1 accoustic/electric bass
1 accostic/electric guitar (incl banjo)
4 perc (incl 1 timp as needed)

I am assuming the question relates only to instruments. I would also use a conductor and 2 singers.