Negative affects from your passion for music?

[Nefertiti]

What I mean is what areas in your life have been affected negatively by your passion for music? Probably about once a week my wife will say "What's wrong with you?" or "What were you thinking?" I'm 40 and in many ways still like I was when I was 17. Things like I'll be totally into practicing something and stay up until 2 in the morning knowing I have to get up at 6 with the kids. then I'll be exhausted the next day and barely functioning. I still do this even now. i know long term it's not good for my health either. I'm just curious what aspects of your lives have been affected in a bad way. I know there are more for me. I'll post them as I think about them.

[Martinman]

My grades suffered somewhat in high school because I practiced instead of studying as much as I needed to. I also only got about 6 hours of sleep a night (I know its not that bad, but still) if I was lucky and was tired all the time, almost dozing off in class, etc. I also had stiff neck problems before I bought a BG neck yoke.

[SaxJazz12]

Although music has benefited my life in countless ways, it has at times had a negative affect on my self-esteem. How I "sound" often has too big an affect on "the big picture" (how I feel about myself as person, self-worth, etc). Reading the book Effortless Mastery helped, although it is not a cure-all.

[Ruediger Kramer]

i play (and practise) to much - my time get´s tight...

:shock:

[Tryptykon]

What I mean is what areas in your life have been affected negatively by your passion for music? Probably about once a week my wife will say "What's wrong with you?" or "What were you thinking?" I'm 40 and in many ways still like I was when I was 17. Things like I'll be totally into practicing something and stay up until 2 in the morning knowing I have to get up at 6 with the kids. then I'll be exhausted the next day and barely functioning. I still do this even now. i know long term it's not good for my health either. I'm just curious what aspects of your lives have been affected in a bad way. I know there are more for me. I'll post them as I think about them.

Why ?

[Nefertiti]

Why ?

That's what my wife says!

[hakukani]

I just chalk it up to a relatively healthy manifestation of OCD.

[Tryptykon]

I'm sure she does .

[littlewailer]

My grades suffered somewhat in high school because I practiced instead of studying as much as I needed to. I also only got about 6 hours of sleep a night (I know its not that bad, but still) if I was lucky and was tired all the time, almost dozing off in class, etc. I also had stiff neck problems before I bought a BG neck yoke.

This happened to me as well. To the point that I'm worried about my grades as far as entering into a post secondary education. I may have to do night school as far as a science or even gr. 11 math goes.

[littlemanbighorn]

Generally the most common area in my life which is negatively affected by my passion for music is my bank account. (buying gear, upkeep on horns, buying records, student loans, not making all that much money, etc ad infinitum)......

[BobbyC]

My wife and kids used to get upset because I was playing every weekend and they didn't see me much between work and band.

Vacations were almost impossible.

[Nefertiti]

The reason I bring this up is because it seems like I find myself warning my students to not make some of the mistakes I did. I don't know if it does any good but I try. I had a student come in exhausted and he said he was up late practicing. He couldn't play what I assigned him and he was boggled at why since he could do it perfect the night before and spent half the night working on it. I asked him how much sleep he ended up getting......3-4 hours. i gave him my usual lecture.:)

[Bossman]

Sometimes if I have a bad day of practice or I have a clammy performance at a gig it'll ruin my week and I tend to be rude and very irritable.

But there's no better feeling than having a great practice. Except maybe a great gig.

As someone said before, music has a huge influence on "who I am" and sometimes I do not see the big picture. Does missing 1 day of flute long tones really make me a terrible person?

It can be very depressing sometimes.

[baylistenor]

Recently a good, good player said to me "this thing - (points to horn) is ruining my life"
DON,T LET IT RUIN YOURS .
Music is for pleasure not to bugger you up - however serious you are.

[Reedsplinter]

Turned me into a "music snob," by the lights of others who are less serious about what they listen to and hear into it less deeply. This, however, is a judgment I don't share; I don't tell other people what to listen to and what to avoid; I only pursue my own interests. Some folks seem put off by this. I do the same with what I read (as I am a writer by profession), and that puts off some people in the same way.

Ours seems to be a culture in which it's taboo to have serious passions -- vocational or avocational -- which are non-athletic and/or non-scientific.

[gary]

Probably the biggest thing is not being present - in the now. I have almost always music going on in my head. I'm not there when I'm there. Leads to a certain detachment that can have negative consequences.

[saxmanglen]

My biggest negative is the decreased funds in my bank account.

[Ralfy]

The reason I bring this up is because it seems like I find myself warning my students to not make some of the mistakes I did. I don't know if it does any good but I try. I had a student come in exhausted and he said he was up late practicing. He couldn't play what I assigned him and he was boggled at why since he could do it perfect the night before and spent half the night working on it. I asked him how much sleep he ended up getting......3-4 hours. i gave him my usual lecture.:)

School starts too early and is way to geared toward morning people.

Although music has a few negative ends to it I don't think they matter compared to the things we gain from it. At least for me.

[Pgraves]

I just chalk it up to a relatively healthy manifestation of OCD.

Nice labeling. Some have it worse than others.
The point is keeping track of where the healthy/unhealthy line is.
I suppose feedback from others in your life is a clue, assuming they are "healthy".

The OCD/perfectionism blend is different for everyone. Nobody becomes very proficient without countless hours of practice. It takes some of it (OCD blend) to want to make yourself do that.

I think these topic also fits in with this thread
http://forum.saxontheweb.net/showthread.php?t=71917

[LampLight]

A lot of people dream their lives away wishing they could do the thing they were totally passionate about. It's hard to be a totally passionate artist and a responsible husband, daddy, and bread winner. I expect it's not easy to be totally passionate artist under any circumstances. It will hurt your health and disrupt both your life and the lives of people around you. Call it OCD if you want, but maybe you're more on the right track than you think.

EDIT: corrected a typo.

[SneekyJones]

Hi Nef,

Great topic. All this time, I'm thinkin': "What are the things that are directly affecting my passion for music"? I guess I had it backwards.

By the way, I will comment on your website about your II-V-I book after I finish doin' some more things with it.
Right now, I like picking exercises (for example maj. 4. 8. and 12.) to play into each other for a 12 bar feel using a I IV I pattern (D-4bars, G-4bars, A-4bars).

Sorry, got off topic... I will just say that what ever we do, we do it because thats who we are. It is human tendency an nature to gravitate towards the things that bring us inner peace and happiness. I'm just glad I'm not a dreamer as Lamplight mention of some.

After I finish workin with the book, I'll get your lesson too. This way I can give a more informative review on your websight.

You can never have enough II-V-I's!

Peace as always,

SneekyJones

[BayviewSax]

All of the above. I'm a ****ing mess.

Fortunately, I'm married to an avocative artists, professional educator, total type-A go-getter... who is very supportive of my pursuits. Nice to get one right once in awhile.

[Ben Marrow]

I just chalk it up to a relatively healthy manifestation of OCD.

AMEN! Whatever gets you through the night! Even though I do find my social interaction waning under a heavy musical compulsion, I have discovered and confronted a lot of my personal fears as the result of diligent and mindful practice routines--Ah, the emotional frontiers of musicality!:)

[Al Stevens]

Music and other outside activities cost me a marriage, the most profound loss I ever endured. Fortunately, she came to her senses :) and returned. It's been fine ever since.

[Reedsplinter]

A lot of people dream their lives away wishing they could to the thing they were totally passionate about. It's hard to be a totally passionate artist and a responsible husband, daddy, and bread winner. I expect it's not easy to be totally passionate artist under any circumstances. It will hurt your health and disrupt both your life and the lives of people around you. Call it OCD if you want, but maybe you're more on the right track than you think.

This becomes all the more true if you're practicing more than one art form, as in my case. You'd think at least one of them could be law! Or something weasel-y that pays!:shock:

[LampLight]

Well, if you can equate law to an art form, then at least you're practicing creative writing. We could use you here in DC. :)

[Jazzed]

I'm a single guy that isn't gigging much these days. Every girlfriend I've had, I met playing sax. I'm not very good at approaching women due to my previously heavy gigging-- they always approached me!! I gotta get some gigs again- just got hired for next weekend.

[Jolle]

It gets me tired, it drains my bank account, it interferes with my social life...

Hey, I'm a real artist! :D

Well, I can also say it relaxes me, it gives me an income and it makes me meet people I would never meet otherwise. For me, it's a matter of perspective.

But it won't make me rish, that's for sure.

[Nick880]

Lots of positives, sometimes partially counter-balanced with a lesser negative (getting a buzz from a gig, but struggling to get a decent amount of sleep after.....) but the biggest negative for me is that I sometimes feel that I suffer from some kind of symptoms similar to ADD..........:shock: For example, my wife often complains because my attention drifts while trying to watch a movie........... nine times out of ten this is because there is a tune going on in my head. It could be a favourite piece of music that I feel like listening to at that time, or it could be a noodle that I want to try out on the horn. But, the fact is that most of the time there is something musical in my head which prevents me (as Gary said earlier) from being entirely "present".

[stefank]

Well, I didn't finish my first degree because I was busy reading the collected music criticisms of George Bernard Shaw when I was supposed to be writing essays on economic geography - or perhaps I was perusing facsimiles of Thomas Morley first editions. It's not just that music is a distraction in my life, it's a compulsion.

[Dan Forshaw]

I recently got hold of 'Secrets of performing confidence' now, there were not many secrets, more a sense of "oh, I'm not the only one that feels like this" according to this guys research, the biggest stressors i the music biz are

- Worrying because of lack of gigs
- Having to play music you don't like to earn a living
- Stress put upon personal relationships
- Feeling that you need to become better known and / or better paid

However the biggest one was 'Feeling you must reach or maintain the standards of musicianship that YOU SET FOR YOURSELF'

I've read Effortless mastery and it's a very important principle ego will destroy you - yet, despite all i try to do to push it aside it still is slowly killing me

[Dan Forshaw]

ps I'm supposed to be writing a research paper of reconciliation in Northern Ireland at the moment.......so yea I can't concentrate on anything else!

[docformat]

It has taken it's toll on my personal life. As someone pointed out, it's hard to be committed to your instrument and your family at the same time.

However, I have found something that has counter-balanced it to an extent. By giving up drinking I save a lot of money and don't spend every Friday night down the pub. This makes up for it.

[SneekyJones]

Originally posted by... SneekyJones
Right now, I like picking exercises (for example maj. 4. 8. and 12.) to play into each other for a 12 bar feel using a I IV I pattern (D-4bars, G-4bars, A-4bars).

I meant to say using a I IV V (Dmaj II-V-I 4bars, Gmaj II-V-I 4bars, Amaj II-V-I 4bars) blues type feel over 12 bars picking certain excercies. Sometimes ill use the same pattern. I also like how you can use the patterns anyway your mind will allow; the circle of 4ths, 5ths, improv.

U see Nef, I probably would've never made that mistake in post #21 in the first place, if it were not for my attention being drawn to my online accounting brush up course. What a lack of focus on my part. I can't expect for people to understand what I'm "thinking" you know. I guess thats what my horn is there for.
Even though the course may help get a promotion in the future or somethin, I still view it as a distraction to my music :) .

Be well,

SneekyJones

[SneekyJones]

And I still got it wrong....naming an affect something has on my music, and not an affect my music has on something.

Dang man, you'd think I'm dyslectic or something. The only time I read notes backwards is in my head thinking modes. Does that qualify me?

I'll get it right one day.

I'm goin' to go lay it down for the night.

Sneeky

[Sopgirl497]

:)
I'm currently in high school, and I play the Soprano. I practice sooo much, mainly for my own enjoyment, but also for important performances. Since I'm one of the brightest crayons in the box (Not to toot my own horn, or anything, but it's statistically proven by my counselor) I'm in some hard classes.
This constant practicing is taking away from homework and study time.
Also, I don't ever leave the house, because of my Soprano. I've named her, and talk about her all the time, because she is my life. My friends from school call me crazy and anti-social, but I can't help it :)

[fluteypiccolosax]

:)
I've named her, and talk about her all the time, because she is my life. My friends from school call me crazy and anti-social, but I can't help it :)


ha sounds like me with my flute

[Ralfy]

:)
I'm currently in high school, and I play the Soprano. I practice sooo much, mainly for my own enjoyment, but also for important performances. Since I'm one of the brightest crayons in the box (Not to toot my own horn, or anything, but it's statistically proven by my counselor) I'm in some hard classes.
This constant practicing is taking away from homework and study time.
Also, I don't ever leave the house, because of my Soprano. I've named her, and talk about her all the time, because she is my life. My friends from school call me crazy and anti-social, but I can't help it :)

You've inspired me to name my electric guitar and she's going to be my best friend. I'm not naming my bari because I don't see a bari sax as a she.

Hmmm....what to name my electric? Any ideas?

[LampLight]

Not Lucille; that's taken.

[Sopgirl497]

Well, it doesn't always have to be a girl name. I have a trombone named Douglass, a Bari named Gregory, a Tenor named Ronald, and then my Soprano named Sophie (The only girl in the bunch)


:) As for your guitar, if it's a girl, I think Stacy is a nice name, or Victoria. But that's just what I'd name a guitar if I had one :P

[Dr G]

<groan>

[Jonathan C.]

Something I have noticed is moodswings. I spend alot of spare time before something major like auditions or a preformance freaking myself out, but then I do pretty good. If I don't do that, I screw it up entirelly. I know it puts a strain on my friendships, because when somethings not right with me its noticable. I withdraw, refrain from talking, and get sullen.

Great thread by the way.

[Greg_Ace]

Wow, so many things in this thread I resonate with (pun intended, sorry)! Self-esteem issues/mood-swings, spending money, reduced social interaction, distracted by music in my head (or on a movie soundtrack, or a public sound system - esp. if it's bad), procrastinating on other responsibilities, music-snobbishness. Nice to know I'm not a freak...or rather, if I am, at least there are kindred spirits out there!

On the positive side, since I'm long-divorced (for non-musical reasons) and now that my son is grown and out on his own, I've finally got a lot of free evenings that I can usually devote to the hours of practice needed to improve myself as a musician. Having this pursuit keeps me from otherwise wasting that unstructured time being a couch potato and drinking too much beer. Music, both playing and listening, is also a source of joy, which gives me direction and purpose and a reason to get out of bed in the morning. I'd say that's worth the cost!

[jacobeid]

During solo and ensemble over the weekend I fumbled 2 beats out of the song and I put myself down for it for the entire day. Really a drag, but I couldn't help it.

[bluesaxgirl]

Some people don't understand when I say, "I hear symphonies in my head," and go crazy because I don't have any paper to write it down.

They just don't understand. :(

[Ol Danl]

My wife seems to think these wrinkles emanating from the corners of my mouth are due to 45 years of flute embouchure. Apparently makes me look quite a bit older than my current 55 years.

[j3rry85]

1. Costs me money
2. Costs me time
3. My room-mate says that I'm much too single minded for my clarinet and sax

But I'm really enjoying it... Whenever a party is thrown, and someone brings guitar - it's fun to play along with the guitarist and everybody appreciates it - so moments like this are worth it - speaking about that I can't wait for my first "real" gig...

[MyMartinTenor]

Different issues at different points in my life. In high school, it (plus some other "recreational" activities) severely damaged my grades. I graduated right at the line of the bottom 1/3 of my high school class, and was refused from several colleges. (FWIW, I ended up graduating college with highest honors, just a question of focus on the academics, as needed.)

These days, its a question of time allocation. Last night I went to check out a big band performance when I should have been working late. I'll pay for that tonight, when I should be going to play blues but will instead be working late. If I didn't practice, I'd do more housework and projects. But I play to stay sane despite brutal working hours, so it pays itself off.....

[Enviroguy]

I'm just curious what aspects of your lives have been affected in a bad way. I know there are more for me. I'll post them as I think about them.

1. Habitual humming or tapping of feet that I am often unconscious of.

2. Having songs "stick" in my head if there is not music to listen to.

3. Professionally, having a heavily "left brained" job but actually being a very "right brained" person. I believe music as permanently affected what would have naturally been my left-dominant brain. I work with, talk like and look like an engineer, but I feel most comfortable hanging out with "hippies" and artists.

4. Like Nef, I am in my 40's and in many ways am I still like I was when I was 17. I also seem to be able to relate to my teenage son's and daughter's friends much better than other parents do. And I don't relate as well to many guys my age that aren't musicians or artists.

5. I don't practice near as much as Nef, but if I am working on something new or special, I will spend most of my free time absorbed in it and forget everything else.

6. Since I am often heavily involved in the worship services at my church, I don't seem to have time to enjoy, meditate and reflect on the service. I am usually too busy planning, preparing or doing. What should be spiritual time gets replaced with concerns of broken reeds and wondering if my tuba player is going to show up.

But in the end, these are very small prices to pay for the privilege of having people actually be happy to come and listen to me blow my sax. And I would make this same deal again if given the chance. ;)

[LampLight]

. . .
4. Like Nef, I am in my 40's and in many ways am I still like I was when I was 17. I also seem to be able to relate to my teenage son's and daughter's friends much better than other parents do. And I don't relate as well to many guys my age that aren't musicians or artists.
. . .


This is a bad thing?

Good for you!

[lovesthesax]

For me it's a bit of OCD and self-perfectionism... and it can get pretty frustrating. Always have to remind myself that it's about playing to enjoy the music instead of forcing myself to be have to play at a certain level.

But time is definitely a struggle. I think I'm compromising my non-music career in order to find time to practice. Not to the point of getting fired, but at a point where I'm passing up advancement opportunities and chances for growth in order to make time to practice. Not a good thing probably.

[SaxSamour]

Recently a good, good player said to me "this thing - (points to horn) is ruining my life"
DON,T LET IT RUIN YOURS .
Music is for pleasure not to bugger you up - however serious you are.

That´s so sad, these is suposed to be something to enjoy, I do.

[cpete]

Oh, well this is an easy one. Three divorces.

[Tim Price]

Negative effects? NO.
My glass is half full and will stay that way.

I went thru high school playing gigs, almost taking a gig with the 1910 Fruit Gum Co. after they heard me at a local fair. A local fair in which at 16 years old I was playing a strip tent which was called " The Coppertone Show". The band came in to dig the show and liked my playing. The start of a life of knowing....this is MY decision and this is what I put into it. Naturally I had to refuse the gig but I played a cool show, at 16, with some pretty raunchy Ritas as the main attraction and loved it. I met guys in high school that were on their path, I was on mine. My life then was taking lessons, practicing, being inspired by everyone I could hear, and knowing THIS was my decision. Many folks never had that choice nor had the chance to take lessons like I did or be in possession of a Selmer MK6 tenor ( cost my mom 265 bucks!! ) and a Brillhart level air #5 metal mouthpiece.
( Yup I was always a baffle kinda guy- even tho I didn't know WTF a baffle was in those times LOL ) I also played flute and bassoon in high schol and piano. My piano teacher was a student of Lennie Tristano, and my lessons were at 9:00 at night. He would play me the Tristano solos with Bird, and we'd rap about voicings and gettinbg my piano thing going. We used the COUPERIN piano books and Hanon. I used to try to play stuff with stride bass like " Sweet and Lovely" for my lessons and more modern stuff like " Song For My Father". He set me up later for my studys with Margret Chaloff ( Serges mom) when I hit Boston.

What I'm pointing at is..Music is my sanctuary.

I'll explain my mind set , in a way.
This ain't easy out here.
I've been REAL lucky to have the friends I do.
Could say its some kinda luck or whatever.
BUT, music is our sanctuary.
Our inner spot to focus and grow and have fun.
How many people , off the street, do you guys think could go put on a Sonny Rollins CD and just start crackin' up at the crazy stuff
Sonny is playing ? My brother in law is a good guy- I relate to him just fine. I don't look for him to borrow my Braxton Cds nor do I want him too. haha- Though his wife comes to all my gigs and is very very supportive of me.
My neighbors are cool- but I don't look to rap about Whammy pedals or reeds with them! lol-:badgrin: haha. I loan them my weed trimmer or help them snow blow their property with my snow blower, but I keep it...in perspective.


I do not watch a lot of TV. I kinda never did lived 4 years in Boston
and never had a TV. Ditto- when I lived in the Bronx.( 1973 ) But again ,I was lucky. I lived near the great Tuba player Ray Draper and we would shed together. I think,this music is my sanity factor as well. But that IS just me. You know like the tune Prez played.." Just you , Just
Me".

Ever think how boring life could be WITHOUT music.


I am... positive cuz I want to exist in a pleasant scene as much as possible.
Life goes by to quick- There's so much OTHER negative/sad
stuff around us that I view music as my santuary.

But , I enjoy what I do. I like playing my horn.
Like I said before- If someone hears me & likes it cool. If they don't,
that's cool to.

LIKE CHARLIE PARKER SAIS......if you don't live it
it won't come out of your horn.

Here's another thing :
For 8 years, 16 Sundays a year ....
I was a artist in-residence in a Philly
MAX SECURITY prison.The 5th largest
in the States.
I taught my class , without a guard in
the room.That WAS my choice.
These guys understood - RESPECT .
Nobody got salty , or told anyone else any BS about anything.
THEY SHARED !!
I taught a jazz ensemble .
These guys had awful horns /reeds etc
I had some very good players in there.
These guys worked.
They APPRECIATE this gift of music...
cuz they KNOW what its like without it.
They made me proud- we played the
Mellon jazz fest. from " Inside the walls".
Grover Washington Jr. was our special guest.
I knew all the NAACP dudes within the prison.
I knew the guys who pulled the worst jobs, violence, murder,drugs,dope, hot goods, armed robbery.More!!! :shock:
BUT- When I played my concerts in there
I brought in players like Johnny Coles,Micky Roker or Billy James .
We brought the house down !!!!
It was beautiful- the vibe was better than a club.
It felt like yea- PLAY!! Those guys who were in for life and big crime
were in the front row,quiet & lovin' the music.Like a rare meal they knew what music meant. BTW- this is the same prison , in the 50's where the tune " Theme For Ernie" was composed !! I used toplay " The Trip" by Art Pepper for them and it was amazing the vibe that went down when the music hit-DAMN COOL.

GET MY POINT ??:)

MUSIC.....is a special thing.

A rare gift... ENJOY IT. SHARE .

Hope those of you who know, got my point. 8-)

It's a choice, and NOT an athletic event. Sometimes I get lucky, sometimes I don't. If I ever gotta dump mulch for a living or something I'll know I put 100% plus into something..I WANTED TO DO.

GET MY DRIFT?:D

[Yofis]

I had something to add...but I've forgotten it now.

[silvin]

There are some negative affects, but I can't live otherwise, so ... Problem solved

[rim shot]

I had a student come in exhausted and he said he was up late practicing. He couldn't play what I assigned him and he was boggled at why since he could do it perfect the night before and spent half the night working on it. I asked him how much sleep he ended up getting......3-4 hours. i gave him my usual lecture.:)

Yeah nef... I can definitely see it- but it´s not convincing to say "do as I say and not as I do".
Nevertheless I understand quite well the situation with wifey (also known, in some circles, as "trouble and strife")... yet I digress.
I have always found it difficult to break the habit of staying up until 1-2 am or so... because, children or not... we have simply done it for so long.
Also, I find it relaxing to be up when everyone else is asleep.
Yeah- 6am... RIIIINNNGGG!!! is a problem, also... with wanting not to be just a vegetable when with the kids, or otherwise... for that matter.

[rim shot]

Negative effects? NO.
Here's another thing :
For 8 years, 16 Sundays a year ....
I was a artist in-residence in a Philly
MAX SECURITY prison.The 5th largest
in the States.


That is absolutely awesome.
Thank you for telling us about this stuff, man.
Thank you.

[jrvinson45]

I had something to add...but I've forgotten it now.

I think what you meant to say was... oh, oh, lost it....

[jaysne]

Well, there's the societal feeling that musicians are slackers and that if you do music as your job, you don't have a "real" job, and this makes you less worthy of respect than, say, a doctor or a software engineer.

Then there's the economic aspect of not making much money. I find that to be troubling at times, since although I enjoy what I do--I'm a full-time school band director--I don't make enough money to afford something "normal" adults can afford, like a house.

[hakukani]

Well, there's the societal feeling that musicians are slackers and that if you do music as your job, you don't have a "real" job, and this makes you less worthy of respect than, say, a doctor or a software engineer.

Then there's the economic aspect of not making much money. I find that to be troubling at times, since although I enjoy what I do--I'm a full-time school band director--I don't make enough money to afford something "normal" adults can afford, like a house.

Even when I was running sound 40+ hours a week, someone would invariably come up to me and ask what my 'real' job was...

[cpete]

[QUOTE=hakukani when I was running sound 40+ hours a week, someone would invariably come up to me and ask what my 'real' job was...[/QUOTE]

I heard you took over for Don Ho:D

[Tim Price]

Negative effects? NO.
Here's another thing :
For 8 years, 16 Sundays a year ....
I was a artist in-residence in a Philly
MAX SECURITY prison.The 5th largest
in the States.


That is absolutely awesome.
Thank you for telling us about this stuff, man.
Thank you.


NO..Thank you for understanding it.

Everything ain't in clubs, nor is it in the ivory towers. This prison was also pretty intense. 5th largest max security in USA and- the rehab within was pretty inspiring.

Also, let me say this. That prison is outside Philly. Its no joke.
Sure ain't a blue collar prison. BUT- the respect I got in there as a jazz musician was unreal. I did holiday concerts for them, got Yusef Lateef to come in as a quest and other "perks". Some of the guys my age were there via some pretty deep narcotic situations via VietNam & the era.
It taught me something about life. One of the things was personal strength as to the freedom to ..make a choice..those guys at their point had no choice. They were someones job, and part of the machine. Many that made it to program were talented. One guy played vibes, bone, flute and was a great cook. Nam messed him up bad. One of the other guys was from Cleveland originally and was hip to Lovanos dad & the scene. EG-Joe Alexander etc. When my grandmother passed, all the guys in program made a card for me, and all signed it.Pretty touching and sais something.

So you want to reach folks or relate to people that are not musicians? I dunno- when I play I play in place that people of all back rounds come too. Be it a jazz gig, Grateful Dead jam band, bar etc. You got to deal with thehuman race, and know where the vibe is via club owners, etc etc. Everything counts, life lived so to speak.

Anyhow, hth.

[jaysne]

BUT- the respect I got in there as a jazz musician was unreal.

I have a sax player friend who had just gotten married and on the way to the airport for their honeymoon, he and his wife's car broke down. This is about 4 am on the PA/Jersey border. They hole up in a 24-hour diner and wait for me and another friend to come and pick them up. We get there and find them sitting at the bar eating eggs and drinking coffee. We start chatting about what to do and during a lull, I see this rough-looking guy amble up to the bar. He eyes my buddy suspiciously and asks him what he does, and he replies, "I'm a jazz musician." Immediately the look in the guy's eyes changed from suspicion to respect, with some softness and love thrown in.

With what other profession could you get such a reaction?

[Tim Price]

BUT- the respect I got in there as a jazz musician was unreal.

I have a sax player friend who had just gotten married and on the way to the airport for their honeymoon, he and his wife's car broke down. This is about 4 am on the PA/Jersey border. They hole up in a 24-hour diner and wait for me and another friend to come and pick them up. We get there and find them sitting at the bar eating eggs and drinking coffee. We start chatting about what to do and during a lull, I see this rough-looking guy amble up to the bar. He eyes my buddy suspiciously and asks him what he does, and he replies, "I'm a jazz musician." Immediately the look in the guy's eyes changed from suspicion to respect, with some softness and love thrown in.

With what other profession could you get such a reaction?

Thanks for that. Excellent.

In life a person has so much to look forward to, so much to look forward to as a musician. I'm not talking about just gigs, but the actual travel in he music. Learning, study, teaching and so on.

It is not what happens that matters, what matters is how you respond to what happens.You need to have courage, think positively, and have hope. Be self-reliant and determined.

The world doesn’t owe you a living because you play saxophone!! LOL.
If you want something, you were created with the capacity to go ahead and get it! Playing the saxophone is the ultimate freedom of expression.


Your life is the sum result of all the choices you make, both consciously and unconsciously. You can find the freedom that comes from being in charge of yourself ! IF YOU WANT TO PLAY JAZZ- Play jazz !!!!!
Lastly musicians need to learn to encourage themselves more , remember this Chinese saying: “As long as you remain alive, you should not fear the journey ahead.”

[jftuga]

Some people at work think I like elevator music :? For example, I was listening to some jazz the other day and one of my coworkers asked me if I was on hold!

-John

[Michael Ward]

...that's funny.

Usual stuff..a divorce..bad fit. Just spent 3 years recovering from a disabled hand... But life is great..I've never had a day job apart from a week as a breakfast waiter in a casino. Went straight from school on the road. Earn all of my living from writing or producing music and playing..Have a great artistic wife who has a great ear and taste..Plays Trane in the artshop where she works
Work with interesting sensitive people everyday...I have had bad years working with the wrong people but What Doesn't Kill You makes you stronger..right? Well sometimes. Don't have a lot of money..but have enough of everything.
I'm off to the studio now to produce a vocal and later play some tenor horn parts.. Couple of recording sessions with my bands lined up...Life. is Good.

[kwgrinnell]

The biggest negative for me has to be the ringing in my ears, it drives me nuts. I have a bit of equipment, (15 players of various flavors) but have always made money and never spent more than I made. Time with my family has always been a priority so even with practice and performance I let them know they are first. Fortunately I have been successful and retired (yes retired) 2 yrs ago at the ripe old age of 49. My playing consists of practice, church and the occasional coffeehouse, prison or festival.

K
42 yrs of sax and going strong

[jrvinson45]

Well, there's the societal feeling that musicians are slackers and that if you do music as your job, you don't have a "real" job, and this makes you less worthy of respect than, say, a doctor or a software engineer.

Then there's the economic aspect of not making much money. I find that to be troubling at times, since although I enjoy what I do--I'm a full-time school band director--I don't make enough money to afford something "normal" adults can afford, like a house.

Ok jaysne, here's a silver lining for you. Almost five years ago we sold a house in California and moved to Arizona. We put down a huge down payment on the current house about 10 milliseconds before the housing market started to tank. Today, while we've not yet been hit by the foreclosure bug, our house has lost all of the equity acquired with the down payment plus it's lost equity because it's currently several tens of thousands below what we owe on the mortgage. In other words, today owning your own house can be a liability rather than an asset. If someone bought a house like mine on the current market, they would have a much lower house payment and lower mortgage. The state has yet to accomodate the fact that the lower appraisal value should reduce the value against the taxable value, but it hasn't yet...

You're doing just fine. Hang in there.

[kwgrinnell]

"Then there's the economic aspect of not making much money. I find that to be troubling at times, since although I enjoy what I do--I'm a full-time school band director--I don't make enough money to afford something "normal" adults can afford, like a house."

Odd, I don't post here much and don't have a "brand name" but I've made enough to retire young and will be closing the sale of the house I built 10 yrs ago and using the proceeds to remodel my current home and get a few more toys. My secret? Don't spend more than you make and keep busy, also know when enough is enough and how much is good enough.

K
42 yrs of sax and going strong

[jrvinson45]

"Then there's the economic aspect of not making much money. I find that to be troubling at times, since although I enjoy what I do--I'm a full-time school band director--I don't make enough money to afford something "normal" adults can afford, like a house."

Odd, I don't post here much and don't have a "brand name" but I've made enough to retire young and will be closing the sale of the house I built 10 yrs ago and using the proceeds to remodel my current home and get a few more toys. My secret? Don't spend more than you make and keep busy, also know when enough is enough and how much is good enough.

K
42 yrs of sax and going strong

also... don't try to live in CA or NYC... good words, kwgrinnell.