Sax or trumpet

[sassoc]

I have been toying with a new idea whether to pick up the sax or the trumpet for some jazz or blues. Can anyone out there help me out here which to decide.

[Mr. Blue Notes]

I may be going out on a limb here, but I suspect that on this forum the overwhelming vote will be in favor of the sax. But seriously, the trumpet is a fine instrument, and its place in jazz/blues cannot be questioned; but nothing beats the rich, round tones of a tenor sax.

[Jazzophone]

lol yes, indeed. did you expect to get a unanimous vote for trumpet on Sax on the Web? :lol: but indeed, tenor sax, the greatest. However, trumpet AS WELL would for sure boost a lot of stuff. I play trumpet very marginally. It's good for sax breath control.

[Mike W]

Go for both--twice the fun!

[Jon B. Bop]

I played the trumpet for about 18 months a while back, and play tenor now. The main difference is that the trumpet is more physically demanding.

Embouchure development is a battle on trumpet, and you can't play the higher notes at all until your embouchure is there.

Also, It's difficult to play for any length of time on trumpet(early on), due to lip fatigue.

Of course, it's probably equally difficult to become a quality player on either.

[Zman]

I play both trumpet/flugel and the Bb saxes. 30 years on trumpet, 3 years on tenor and soprano. Either way, you have quite a challenge ahead.

It is true that trumpet is physically demanding if you really push the instrument. On the other hand, tenor can take a LOT of air as well. I find sax to be quite physical when you are really into your expression. Mechanical skills are apples and oranges, both require much practice. One cool thing is that right hand key patterns on trumpet and tenor are very similar. Learn one, adapt to the other without a problem. Of course, on trumpet your left hand just hangs out and holds the instrument, while left hand on sax is a developed skill.

If you have the time and resources, I suggest that you explore both initially, then focus on the instrument that really makes your soul sing. I would have a hard time choosing between flugel and tenor for cool, from-the-soul musical expression. I love them both.

[gary]

Having played trumpet for 15 years, 5 of that profesionally and now playing woodwinds, for me there is a tremendous difference, not only in the instruments (as mentioned above, trp being quite physical), but in the way woodwind players and trumpeters think about music and their instruments. Sometimes, even to the musical value systems.

There are differences in the feel when one plays, the way you hear the instrument when you play, and other factors. For me, there `re more subtilities I can do on the sax than on trumpet.

Either way, you've got to put a lot of work into them to make them work for you. Enjoy.

[Mike W]

ZMan, is the flugelhorn easier on chops for a beginner? I picked up an old Holton (1947) long model cornet a while back (amazingly in pretty good condition) and am having a ball with it. I do love the sound of a flugelhorn and might like it better, just like tenor sax is my favorite sax.

[Zman]

Yes, Mike, IMO flugel is an easier instrument to play than trumpet. Besides the mellow tone, flugel can be played quietly, very relaxed, and still sound great. I don't feel like I have to work to play flugel, as I do on trumpet. On a 4-set party gig, I spend much time on flugel, and by the last set I'm playing flugel exclusively. When you are tired, flugel is the trumpet player's best friend.

for me there is a tremendous difference, not only in the instruments (as mentioned above, trp being quite physical), but in the way woodwind players and trumpeters think about music and their instruments. Sometimes, even to the musical value systems

I totally agree with this. I am stoked about playing sax because it is much more than an asthetic choice to switch horns. It is a total change in my frame of reference as a jazz performer. This is very cool, to be able to totally modify your mode of expression on the spot.

Mike, Gary's point is also true of trumpet/flugel, as it is with tenor/soprano. Each instrument is a unique form of expression, and in some cases it can be the wrong choice. So, while Bb is the common pitch for the instruments, the perspective with which each is played must be treated with respect. Clark Terry has said over the years that he decided to specialize in flugel because he preferred the 'flugel view' (smooth and mellow) to the 'trumpet view' (in your face lead sound).

Flugel, like soprano, takes practice to master intonation, because the tone and pitch are very flexible, and very sensitive to the player's chops. That is why some trumpet teachers discourage students from starting on flugel, just as some sax teachers discourage starting on soprano. However, I started on soprano, and had a great experience. I see no reason why a cat can't start on flugel, if that sound and feel give them what they are looking for.

For me, there are more subtleties I can do on the sax than on trumpet.

Man, I also agree with Gary on this. I am amazed at the nuance that is possible with a sax. I guess it's that whole 'similar to human vocal chords' thing. I absolutely love the subtle, complex tones on soprano. Really sweet.

[Mike W]

ZMan, Thanks very much! I'll keep my eyes open for a fluegelhorn.

[Vortex]

I've played both alto sax and trumpet (sax being my much, MUCH greater focus) and I definately recommend sax. It's more demanding than trumpet in the way of finger dexterity, as well as developing your chops. You really have to know a lot about your setup as well.

On the flipside of this, the saxophone is also much more customizable than the trumpet. With trumpet, one has the mute, mouthpiece, and horn itself to modify the sound. With sax, one has the body of the horn, the neck, the mouthpiece, the reeds, ligature, and can do various things like stuff a water bottle into the bell, all of which affect the tone. There's a lot more different articulations for the sax too (growl, flutter, slaptongue, cball lick, etc).

Go for sax. Simply put, you get a lot of versatility in both playing style and tone, much more flexible.

[Mike W]

I have been told by trumpet players that one can growl into a trumpet too. I tried it and it works.

[Zman]

It's more demanding than trumpet in the way of finger dexterity, as well as developing your chops.

To be sure, the trumpet player does not have left hand issues, but chop development is a lifetime pursuit either way. At the serious pro-am and professional level, chop skills develop in extremely fine increments and nuances on either instrument (sax or trumpet).

You really have to know a lot about your setup as well. On the flipside of this, the saxophone is also much more customizable than the trumpet.

Again, at higher skill levels, equipment choices become just as finely detailed for the brass cat as for the sax cat. Just like a sax, every part of the trumpet affects the sound, such that experienced players routinely switch lead pipes, tuning slide shapes, bell pipe parameters, etc. to achieve that 'just right' sound. Flugels come in various bores and bell diameters, all of which greatly affect the sound product. Serious trumpet cats are generally loyal to a good tech or two who understand their playing style, and who can adjust the horn to suit (just like sax cats).

As Gary said, it's really two completely different worlds of expression, both of which have their challenges and satisfactions. I thoroughly enjoy having a foot in both worlds.

I admit though, Vortex, tearing down after rehearsal is a totally different experience for the brass cat and the sax cat:

Trumpet player: throw horn and mpc in case, go for coffee.

Sax player: carefully remove reed from mpc. Swab mpc. Put reed in reed case. Remove neck and swab. Dry pads. Swab body. Argue with other sax player about key clamps. Install key clamps. Speak magical voodoo words before closing case (to keep the vibe for next rehearsal). Go home, because by now the coffee shop is closed. LOL :D

[gary]

Yeah, Z man, LOL and THAT'S with only ONE horn!

One band I play in, I play tenor, alto and flute so multiply your scenario times 2.5. Then there's perhaps at least contact mics to take off and store plus disassembling a four-horn sax/flute/clar stand.

Yup. Pull the trumpet mouthpiece, push the tuning slide in, throw the horn in the case and hit the town. 'Course, one could always be the keyboard player :shock:

[sassoc]

Thanks guys,

I have decided to start off with the sax for now n am now hunting around for a sax which is quite difficult in my country.

[Tom Goodrick]

I'll throw in another consideration. It is far easier to make a decent sound on the sax than on the trumpet when you start. But, if you start on trumpet and put in a lot of hard work, you'll be playing nice in six months. In six years you'll be at a good professional level. Then, you could switch to sax as a doubler and quickly enjoy both. If you start with sax, you'll probably not pick up the trumpet because it will be 'too hard.'

[After_cooldude]

Yeh i totally agree with you Mike W you should go for both. they are quite different the trumpet and the sax but you get youst to it like i did. This has probs been my 6th lesson on the alto sax and you kinda get youst to the changes i suppose. I been playing the trumpet and cornet for about 5 year. Go for both the sax and the trumpet. :D

[Tom Goodrick]

I would like to add a couple things. Playing both sax and trumpet is great because they use different muscles so you can interchange them on a job where you play lead all night. That is why I have taken up the sax very seriously. I can play trumpet, flugel horn, trombone and tenor sax for four hours as lead in a quartet without collapsing! With sax I know I can always make a decent sound even at 1 am. That is not true of the brasswinds.

Also, if you learn one instruement very well, you will learn music pretty well so that your brain knows what it wants to hear. Then, when you take up some other instrument, the learning process is faster.