Flugel or Cornet?

[luck]

I'm a returning sax player who took about ten years off after getting out of high school. Bought a YAS62II a few months ago and I have loved every minute. But now an old problem is rearing it's ugly head. The same problem I had in high school. I want to play everything!! I already play piano (nothing great, but good enough to have a good time, play for friends weddings, church, etc.). I did attempt to play the flugelhorn for a summer in high school, until my band director moved me back over to the sax section (Bari at the time, loved that horn). I just remember really liking the mellow sound of the flugelhorn. I play my sax pretty bright but I guess I'd like to have a mellow "voice" as well. Does anyone have any experience with either the flugel or cornet? Which is easier for a beginner? Not really interested in a trumpet (just too brassy sounding for what I want). I'm not looking to be a pro, just an important hobby. Already have a day job that takes up too much of my time. I'll also be getting sax lessons starting in the next couple months. Just looking for opinions? Thanks for any advice!

[trumpetdude]

well, it depends on what you want to play.

if you are looking for mainly jazz, go with a flugel, although it is harder to learn at first.

The cornet, though, is fine when first learning. Plays similar to a trumpet, but different sound and all. And it is a a little more versitale. Flugels are VERY mellow, and requite a different kind of playing. A cornet though, you can really blow through, and play all sorts of genres of music.


I would say start with a trumpet or cornet. It is a lot easier to learn in all aspects of playing. Then switch to flugel. With flugel, you pretty much roll the air into the horn, very delicate, thus giving it is beauty. On cornet, you don't.

hope this helps.

~Mat

[gary]

Well, I feel insecure offering an alternative suggestion to one from someone with the moniker "trumpetdude", LOL, but my advice would be to get the flugelhorn and go for it.

If that's the sound you are after and the instrument that most fits your musical expression I think starting on a trumpet and/or cornet and then going to the flugelhorn is just adding an unnecessary middle step towards your goal.

If you are going to be an all-around trumpet/cornet/flugelhorn player then starting with trumpet is logical. But if only flugelhorn is your instrument, and if it takes a slightly different technique than trumpet, I would say begin straight away learning that particular technique.

[Tom Goodrick]

I play trumpet, flugel horn, trombone and tenor sax and have for many years with some time out for day work, etc. I played a cornet for several years. That horn has several good applications. It can do Dixieland well or slow and pretty. You should not back away from the trumpet too fast because it is more in what sound YOU want to make with the horn. I play mine rather mellow a lot. I have use Bach 7C and 10 1/2C mouthpieces on trumpet but now play everything with the 10 1/2C. There are times to be piercing and times to be mellow, man.

The only problem with a flugelhorn is the intonation. It is dependent on your lip more than with the other horns.

The trumpet has the advantage that many types of mutes are available to change you sound, enable practice in populated areas and to work your chops against the resistance.

Whatever you buy, get two different size mouthpieces and a good tuning meter like the Seico ST-909 where you can check every note as you play whole notes. You will have to train your lips and your ear.

Another thing you should do is get a good-quality synth that really can re-produce the various instruments. Practice playing the different instrument sounds in solos on the synth and then work to duplicate that sound with your horn or horns.

The good thing is horns of reasonable quality are fairly cheap compared to saxes.

[Tryptykon]

I would go with a nice compromise between the two** which is a cornet
with a *true* cornet mouthpiece; which will have a deeper bowl which yields
a mellower timbre; a more pure sound

The Warburtons are good mpcs .

I play an old King Silvertone which is the same horn as the later silversonic
with the silver bell .




___
**trumpet and flugelhorn

[SaxPlayer1004]

Have you had any experience with brass before? I play tuba and euphonium fairly often, and I have never quite been able to play cornet, and have never for the life of me been able to get a decent sound out of a trumpet. I'm used to playing conical instruments so flugelhorn was a lot easier for me. If you want a big mello sound go for a flugelhorn. Just my experience with the stuff, I try to stick to low brass though.

[hamilton]

I am a former trumpet player and it seems like you would have a better chance getting the sound you are after on the Flugelhorn.If you were to take a trumpet and a cornet and completely straighten out the tubing they would both be the same length.They are very similar, and that more mellow sound comes from the player 90% of the time.On a mouthpiece the deeper the cup,the more mellow it will sound B,C,D,E (B the deepest,E very shallow)
The number system refers to the actual cup diameter #1 being the largest and10 being very small. Remember your lip is the reed here so with a larger cup you have more "reed" to vibrate.Also none of these are very forgiving instruments.I went to a Master Class with Doc Severenson and he said if he misses 1 day of practice He will know, 2days and any musican will know, 3 days and the crowd will know.

[SAXISMYAXE]

As a multi instrumentalist, among them sax and trumpet/cornet, I agree with those who have stated that the Flugelhorn is the harder of the two. It requires that much more in the way of concerted study to master and keep your chops up due in no small part to the more demanding intonation issues.
At the end of the day however, if your heart is set on the Flugelhorn, no amount of pros vs. cons is going to convince you otherwise, so go with what floats your boat.
I went to a Master Class with Doc Severenson and he said if he misses 1 day of practice He will know, 2days and any musican will know, 3 days and the crowd will know.
Isn't that the truth. Unfortunately it is the case with most instruments, which keeps me one busy cuss.

[Tom Goodrick]

I know this is an old thread and our friend "Luck" has probably not been around for a while. But for what it is worth, I have had some thoughts on sax and Flugelhorn lately as I attempt to phase in a soprano sax in addition to my tenor sax, trombone, trumpet and Flugelhorn. I bought the Flugel horn 40 years ago when I was working regularly as a trombonist with some trumpet work. I wanted a nice jazzy but mellow sound - cool jazz. What I found was that I could not get good enough on the Flugelhorn to play it much in public. Intonation was the problem. There was no such problem on tumpet or on an old cornet I played during the same period - mainly on Dixieland.

Recently I ordered a soprano sax and my wife asked me which instrument I was going to "give up." In order to appease her I said the Flugelhorn even though I have recently gotten pretty good on it with daily practice and a good electronic tuner. But it dawned on me that the soprano sax has the cool jazz sound I was searching for when I bought the Flugelhorn.

Doubling between sax and trumpet makes a lot of sense as the embouchers are compatible. Today I pushed my self a bit to get a #3 reed back in action on my Rovner 7 instead of the easier 2.5's I have been playing for a couple of months. The sound is better in some ways but the work is a bit harder for the chops and the diaphragm. When I picked up the trumpet and trombone, they sounded great with better high register sounds than in reent weeks.

So my answer to Mr Luck is to play the trumpet or cornet if he wants a brass instrument. But consider the soprano sax for the mellow sounds. Many people today play the soprano with a very bright and hard sound. But it can still be the most mellow instrument in the band if you want to play it that way and use the right mouthpiece.

[AbrahamFackle]

Most modern cornet mouthpieces are designed to make it sound like a trumpet, and that's what's going to come with a cornet if you buy one. I use a flugelhorn mouthpiece (bach 7c fl) on my cornet and the tone is right in between trumpet and flugel. I think that's one of the best options to get a good cornet sound. I am unaware of anyone who makes a true cornet mouthpiece, but I haven't really looked for one, and I'm sure they're out there somewhere.

[luck]

Thanks for all the replies. In the end , I decided not to get into any brass instruments. Just concentrating on getting my alto chops together for a while. Also, picked up a 1925 Conn alto from my wife uncle. The tech I use should have it cleaned up and ready to go this weekend. Should be a nice horn.