Toneking

[mental_c]

Hi,

I'm planning on buying myself a tenor sax. I'm very limited in funds, but after saving some money I think it's time to start looking. I came across this one. Does anyone recognize the model from these photo's? He said it's a toneking. Is a price of 220,- euros a fair deal? I havn't seen it for real and havn't played it yet, but I will before buying...

Thanks!

Timmy

Some pictures:

[mental_c]

I've been digging a lot and found out it possibly is a Toneking IV (http://www.saxpics.com/cpg143/thumbnails.php?album=2136) with almost no lacquer left. I can't tell if it's naturally worn or artificial removed.

[stevesklar]

Toneking it would be. an early Superba 2 model of one (JK made the Couf Superbas with those 2 point key guards). It's not the Bundy Special varierty as they had a flat lip under the bell lip. So that would theoretically be a very nice sounding horn once all setup.

[stevesklar]

are my eyes decieving me or does that have a RH G# trill key ??
pics aren't high quality enough to tell

[stevesklar]

I've been digging a lot and found out it possibly is a Toneking IV (http://www.saxpics.com/cpg143/thumbnails.php?album=2136) with almost no lacquer left. I can't tell if it's naturally worn or artificial removed.

that one has a RH G# trill key too - same horn as the other one (with a quick observation)

[stevesklar]

i also just noticed it has the high F#, which is more inset to the E key. So you would use your first finger to get high E and to get to the high F#.

I thought B&S only made horns like that or Amati

[mental_c]

I've just got a serial! 65xxx, I think it's from the late 60s.

[stevesklar]

that would put it in the transition from the Bundy Specials design to the the Couf era design. 1970ish I believe.

http://www.saxmaniax.com/snsax.htm#Keilwerth

[mental_c]

I spoke to the current owner earlier and I can come over to try it tomorrow... I'm pretty exited about it... now it only have to sound great and I've got a "new" sax!! :occasion:

And thanks for all the info btw!!!!

[plant]

I have had a tone king for a few months now. 58*** serial. Nickel keys, rolled tone holes, RH F#, g# trill, lucite clothes guard, and I reckon it is a terrific horn. I have not had it adjusted am wondering if that may improve the intonation above G2 to C3 (which is not as good as my series 1 crat). The only other lesser quality is D2 is stuffier than the crat but the tone is great everywhere else, it is really responsive and the ergonomics are excellent.

[SAXISMYAXE]

Hey Mental C,
I remember your inquiry about this horn on another site, and I advised you that they were great players and this horn was under priced.

I understand you have had a chance to play this horn since your initial thread here, would you mind posting your thoughts on your new acquisition?

Cheers.

[mental_c]

I went over to try it yesterday. When I saw it I immediatly fell in love... On those earlier pictures it doesn't look that good, but it was just the picture. A lot of the original lacquer is missing, but it was never artificialy removed or relacquered. Some pads and a few corks need to be replaced, but he took off 30 euros from the price for that. Than I started playing... It's not a Mark VI, but I think it sounds pretty awesome. Very warm, with a little edge it think. Much better than I thought. No leaking or anything. Maybe I'll post a soundclip after the pads are redone. When it all done I'm going to let it evaluate, I'm very curious about it's "real" price. But I believe I've made an awesome deal.

Here's a picture after giving it some loving polishing today ;)

[plant]

Looks great mental c, hope you enjoy playing it.
I am trying to find out what cases these horns fit in. The plastic coating on the original case I have is brittle. Is the tube/bell the same as a SX90? Will it fit in a new keilwerth case?

[SAXISMYAXE]

Yes,

These are fine horns. I'm delighted to hear that you like it and got a good deal.

Cheers.

[plant]

I am answering my own earlier post in this thread but I thought someone might be interested.

Firstly regarding the intonation issue. I took the horn to Brian Dickson (great sax tech) today. We were talking for a bit about the tuning issues and he started to suggest I experiment with crescent tuning. When I mentioned the bottom octave was fine and I was only having probs above G2 he said it could be the position of the octave vent on the neck. He happened to have a couf neck in the shop. The octave vent is closer to the mouthpiece end of the couf neck than the toneking neck and what da ya know, the intonation is heaps better.

Regarding the case issue I bought a hiscox for my aristocrat and the keilwerth just fits in. Very snug with the strap ring touching the side but I reckon it is a good snug fit.

[Herodotus]

I've never heard of this kind of sax.





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[bfoster64]

Hey Plant, how would you rate your Toneking in comparison to your Series I Aristo? Which do you play more?