Snobby Local Store Owners....

[saxymanzach]

*rant on*

Well, as you may know from reading my posts, I am a very proud owner of a Kessler Custom tenor. I believe it is a great sax and the price just can't be beat, but recently I have had a run-in with a local sax shop owner about my horn.

Of course this is one of those guys with a small hole-in-the wall shops with lots of profesional musicians as customers and al least 20 Mark VI's on the wal (none selling for a cent under $6,000). Well, I went in to the shop to buy some reeds, and I notice the nice collection of mouthpieces for sale. I saw a few that I wanted to try and asked the owner if I could do so. Of course, he said yeas and I went out to the car to get my horn.

Once I came back to the store, he had the mouthpieces waiting for me. So, I opened the case and started to pull out my horn. And because the finish of my say looks very similar to the selmer Reference 54, he asked if it was one with a wide grin on his face. I told him "No, It's a Kessler Custom, it's a very..." and he just cut in and said with a disgusted look on his face "Oh, I know that one, that Red China thing, right." At this point I was pretty ticked off, needless to say. But I said, "No, actually it's made in Taiwan." To which he said: "psshhhh...same thing. Why would you buy that?"

Of course, I left that place as soon as possible without being as rude as he. Too bad that guy lost another well-paying customer. Perhaps if he would stop ripping people off with his $6,000+....

Don't get me wrong, I love my Kessler and don't care what anyone else thinks about it, but this guy in particular just rubbed me the wrong way.

*rant off*

Any similar experiences?

[saxshooter]

I got my first pro Alto, a Yanagisawa, back in the early 80's when I was in junior high. Not many had them back then, but at the time the Super Action 80 was not having a great rep (and I was too young/inexperienced to seek out a decent Mark VI) but I had to endure a period of "Huh? Yana-what? Oh, one of THOSE Japanese horns..." from some shop owners. It was a great horn, by the way.

[Al Stevens]

It happens. Once as I was putting gas in my Nissan Sentra there was a GMC pickup at the next pump with "Buy American" stickers all over it. The driver was broadly sneering with exaggerated contempt at my car. I said, "Don't sneer at my car. It was made in Tennessee. Your truck was made in Canada." I thought he was going to hit me.

[Radjammin]

@Al, haha. That's good one. My current car is a Ford Escape, but before that I owned a BMW Z3. The funny thing is I have only driven cards made in America, as the Z3 is made in South Carolina. heh.

Why did I switch? Needed a back seat for my new Son. Why did I go with Ford Escape. First Ford in 15 years I actually liked the body style. Point of the story, I am not going to buy junk just because it's American. How about you offer me a good product and then we can talk.

[Docax]

Pretty easy to guess the place from the description. Don't give it a second thought, he's well known for "strong opinions" about horns. Does great work though.

Of course I could be thinking of the wrong place, from the info given.
Do the Kesslers play more like the P mauriats or more like the Cannonballs?

[saxymanzach]

Hey Alex! Long time, no see! I'm sure you can guess which one. The guy does seem to have strong opinions, but other than this, I have had many pleasant transactions with him. (Although he really does price those horns up to the sky!)

I playtested the Kessler and the P. Mauriat side-by-side and the only difference was the price, IMO.

[Face Ache Mike]

Yeah, a while back I was looking for a digital camera. I called into the main dealership after studying the contents of his window. Id noticed just about every camera had a "buy this and get that free" sticker on it. So I asked the salesman about a camera that took my eye and enqired whether it had anything free with it like the others. I met with a tirade of smarmy comments that went along the lines of "No, it doesnt. We`re already the cheapest camera shop in the UK (which is absolutely not true) so why should we give things away? etc etc". I was dumbfounded at his snotty attitude. Without further comment I handed the camera back and turned about heel. Ive never been back since. I did find the same camera in a smaller shop only 5 minutes walk away and for less money.

[Docax]

Hey Zach. Guessed right, huh? Let's just say if you're playing Catalina's it's easy to go down the street for a reed or something...
He basically likes Mark VI's and Super 20's, although my Keilwerth is "OK, I guess".

I thought the Kesslers and P Mauriats were similiar. The reviews of both have been spectacularly positive. Funny how SOTW will make one much more knowledgable about certain niches in saxes...even vs a very famous store. (seriously, the store has been mentioned in articles, TV shows, even several novels...)

[A Greene]

I know it's too late for this suggestion BUT:

You should have put the horn together and cranked you're coolest stuff. :twisted: A moment to educate. Oh, well. It's not the horn it's the player.

[saxfreak]

Hey Zach. Guessed right, huh? Let's just say if you're playing Catalina's it's easy to go down the street for a reed or something...
He basically likes Mark VI's and Super 20's, although my Keilwerth is "OK, I guess".


If I'm guessing the store correctly, old Conn 10M's are also good, and new Yamahas are good too, if he's selling it.
His opinions on horns are . . . blunt.
I had him do some adjustments on my Yanagisawa 901 bari, and he didn't seem interested, so his adjustments weren't very effective. I had someone else work on it after him, and it plays great. He doesn't even know that I own a Yanagisawa tenor.
However, he did a great overhaul on my Mark VI alto. Also, the horns he sells are set up well (to justify the high price).
(It would be strange if I'm thinking of a different shop than the original post.)

[GAS_Wyo]

You should have put the horn together and cranked you're coolest stuff. A moment to educate. Oh, well. It's not the horn it's the player.
Better yet, have this guy 'reed-up' one of those overpriced mouthpieces and play your horn. It worked like a charm for me. I sold a local shop owner on PMauriat's this way. He is now planning to stock them! :D

[com281]

I know of a small non-chain store in the L.A. California area that does that exact same thing, depending on what's for sale on their wall. There are a series of over-priced Mark VI's and King Super 20's on their wall. When I inquired about getting a Conn Chu Berry, the proprietor told me "they are junk and only old men hold on to those horns". I came back about a year later and saw that he had a gold-plated Conn Chu Berry on the wall. When I inquired about it, he pretty much told me that it was one of the best of the best. I guess that he didn't remember me.

Needless to say, I did not nor would I ever consider buying a horn from this guy. I know he's a salesman and needs to push his products to support his living but don't alienate your potential customers with snobbery.

I just bought an Antigua A582 LQ soprano from Dave Kessler and I must say that this horn is comparable in every way to the Yamaha YS-475 in terms of feel, ease of play and intonation. The small music store owner snobs would probably ridicule these horns but many of them in general are out of touch with the overall saxophone community. The Kesslers sure don't use these tactics and I imagine their successful horn sales speak for themselves.

[J.Max]

I've almost always played Yamahas...even with those, you still get stupid comments. "You play a Yamaha? Why don't you get a real horn like a Selmer? How can you play a horn made by a motorcycle company? etc."

[saintsday]

Cleveland must have better dealers. The owner of the local store who is an authorized dealer for every major brand and the second generation in the business didn't bat an eye when I brought in an SML to A/B against a bunch of new horns. I'm 54 years old and made it clear that I would spend the money to buy whatever I liked best, regardless of brand or price. After several trips back and after trying it at the owner's suggestion, I became the proud owner of a SLS Cannonball stone series. I like everything about it except the cheesy "engraving." And as far as I can tell he treated me very fairly on the price. What the heck, I'll plug him: John Stavash, Educator's Music, Lakewood, Ohio.

[paulwl]

I know of a small non-chain store in the L.A. California area that does that exact same thing, depending on what's for sale on their wall. There are a series of over-priced Mark VI's and King Super 20's on their wall. When I inquired about getting a Conn Chu Berry, the proprietor told me "they are junk and only old men hold on to those horns". I came back about a year later and saw that he had a gold-plated Conn Chu Berry on the wall. When I inquired about it, he pretty much told me that it was one of the best of the best. I guess that he didn't remember me.I had that kind of thing happen - I think unwittingly on the dealer's part - with a dealer in NJ several years ago. I'd visited him and noticed that he had an excellent Conn tenor or two around the place and talked of them in very positive terms.

When I called a month or so later and said I had a tenor I wanted to sell, he asked, "What serial range?" I said #167,000s. "Good!" replied the dealer. "Original lacquer?" he asked. I told him, "No lacquer. Satin silver. No gold wash left in the bell though."

There was an uneasy pause. "Satin silver? Bell wash? Wait - you mean this isn't a Mark VI?" the dealer asked, sounding very confused.

"Never said it was. Chu Berry. One of the early ones." He was audibly let down. He quoted me a lowball offer and I said I'd sooner hold onto her. A few pleasantries and we both gladly got off the phone.