mpc for the martin bari [Archive] - Sax on the Web Forum

Bootman

06-06-2003, 01:25 AM

I have had the best success with a big RPC mpc in the 135 range with a 3 1/2 plasticover. The sound is huge but this is on a Magna Bari, the Lamberson I have here is good too but the sound is thinner than the RPC modified mpc. Ed Pillinger has the specs for this mpc, the window has been enlarged and the rails have been thinned.

Bergs can play well as do various other large chambered mpcs. Big sound equals big chamber on Baritone particularly.

vick

06-06-2003, 04:05 AM

i've been thinking something like a rubber berg 120/2. would that be too bright? if so i'll consider a 120/3 or something in that range.

1saxman

06-09-2003, 12:59 AM

Try to find a rubber Berg from the 'mid-period', the '60s and '70s. They came in the small blue box and had the edge of the shank rounded off. The thing about 'The Martin' baris is a tendency to go sharp in the high notes, and the Bergs seem to handle this the best. I use a 130/1 M on mine with a #3 Rico Plasticover. Even with the Berg, you may have to adjust the key opening heights on the upper loop to tame it. I think the 130/1 sounds perfect for my uses, including R&B, rock, etc., with solos. It's definitely not thin. I wouldn't go with a larger chamber than a #1, but it depends on the tip opening. Down around .110", a 2 or three may be okay with the right reed. I have tried a couple of new Bergs, and they were not like the older ones. One, in fact, wouldn't play at all.

1saxman

06-11-2003, 07:06 PM

Also, the Runyon Custom mpc worked well on my Martin, and I wish I had kept it. I was trying out a Runyon Custom Spoiler, #10. I would not have used the spoiler since it made the sound way too edgy, but without it the mpc was very good - a smooth, full sound, plenty of depth in the low notes and good intonation. This is not the mpc that the Berg is, but nice in a mellower way. The Custom is the mpc that is available in different color transparent plastic - the amber looks great on an old horn, just like the Conn Comet mpc.

mark_m

06-11-2003, 09:42 PM

I have a JJ #10 but I find it plays sharp on my The. If I bring it out so there's 1/2" of cork holding it, it's about right but that's not enough to hold it very well. Nice otherwise...

1saxman

06-12-2003, 03:14 AM

Yeah, that seems to be a problem with The Martins, but shouldn't be, since it has about the longest neck in the bari world. Some guys get extensions put on the neck, but I really don't want to go there. Even with the Berg, I'm not in over halfway on the cork. There is another mpc I should have mentioned, but didn't because it's so one-dimensional, and that's the original Level Air by Brilhart. This mpc is all chamber (we used to call them 'shotgun' mpcs because they have a cylindrical bore all the way up to the end of the baffle - there's no throat in it) and has a long beak. It's about one-half inch longer overall than a Runyon metal Quantum. This mpc will cure The Martin and sounds great on it. I used to play one on mine, but needed more punch in the mid and upper ranges. Still, the Level Air gives a booming low end without equal. You can usually find one on ebay if you're patient. They hold up well with age because they're stainless steel, and I've never seen one with a damaged tip. I'm sure they're out there, though, so be careful. Try a 5* to 7* with a 2 1/2.

vick

06-13-2003, 04:14 AM

i play a level air on tenor and i love it. my only problem is that i want to try a piece before i buy it and i can't do his with most vintage pieces so i will probably have to buy new at woodwind brasswind or some place that lets me trial them. any suggestions for a newer mouthpiece.

steve

06-13-2003, 03:31 PM

My metal 120/3 Berg came from WW&BW...about a year ago.

coufplayer

08-01-2003, 08:37 PM

I'll second using a level air on "The Martin" bari. Mine will shake the walls and intonation is pretty durn good. I'm using it with 2.5 plasticovers and that ads even a bit more edge than normal. It actually fits on the cork nicely - enough depth to hold it well. I tried an Otto Link STM on the advice of someone but was very dissapointed - just seemed stuffy and didn't project well at all.

I've got a metal berg on the way and I'm interested to see how well it works.

vick

08-01-2003, 10:35 PM

i finally settled on a link STM. not quite as much projection as i would like but the depth of the sound just blows me away. it also cured my intonation probs for the most part. i tried the level air and berg. the berg wouldn't even play and the level air was just too thin.

coufplayer

08-02-2003, 12:17 AM

I guess that's why they make both vanilla and chocolate - I would call my level air anything but thin.

vick

08-03-2003, 01:57 AM

don't get me wrong. i love my level air on tenor. its just the one i played on bari was pretty thin in the upper range. i don't know if thats characteristic of the mouthpiece or not, it was just the one i tried.

BariMelt

08-19-2003, 04:51 AM

I play a Runyon metal Quantum (#12) on my Martin Magna bari. Love it. A good Berg works wells too. I use to use a 105/1.

Alan G

08-25-2003, 11:24 PM

Just had to throw in my $0.02.

I've been playing my The Martin Bari with a old Levelair 5*. As others have noticed - it lacks "bark" in the upper stack notes...Hard to get that Mulligan sound.

I've tried a few other pieces - but always ended up with the "falling off the neck" syndrome.

A few weeks ago - I bought a modified Levelair 5* from Bob Reynolds off of ebay. It was advertized that it was opened to a 10*...but really - the reface shortened the facing curve (the tip and rails were especially fine looking) - but the tip opening appears very close to original.

Up-shot is; this new piece sounds much better! - and it's in tune. And it has a bit more bark.

Soooo- perhaps there's a refacer out there that can shorten the lay abit on old Levelairs - and make a bunch of Martin players happy!

MojoBari

08-26-2003, 02:20 AM

I do not play a Martin bari, but I did play a LA 7* for 20+ years. Served me well on a lot of gigs. But I switched to Runyon Quantums a few years ago. Similar, but better for my tastes. Lately I've using a Jaguar on bari: better yet (for me).

ProfessorZeek

09-15-2003, 10:57 AM

any comments on the morgan jazz relative to the morgan double chamber?

Bootman

09-16-2003, 12:57 PM

I tried a Morgan 7J on the Martin Bari here, it wasn't good match. Intonation was interesting and the tone wasn't as full as I would have liked. It would be interesting to try a double chamber and a larger tip opening.

DD3

09-16-2003, 07:07 PM

Bootman, Would you expect much difference the sound when going from a Runyon Custom 7 to a 8 or 9. The sound could be fuller on the bottom and is definitely thin on top. This would be from the perspective of an average player. Thanks, DD

DD3

09-16-2003, 07:09 PM

Bootman, Sorry playing a later model Conn Bari(1970) with a 12M neck. Thanks, DD Plays in tune pretty well

Bootman

09-16-2003, 10:48 PM

The Runyon should be a good choice on that model Conn Bari, the Lamberson would work well as would an RPC. The Quantum in a big tip will surprise you too.

The 8DD came to life with plasticover 3 1/2 reeds, extra depth of tone, more lows and less upper partials in the sound, it still plays like a cane reed in terms of repsonse and feel unlike the Fibracell or Bari reeds. When I return to a Cane reed such as a Rico Royal #4, 3 1/2, RJS 3S or 3H, the tone becomes very bright and somewhat harder to control. There is also a tendency for this mpc to chirp, it is very frustrating but because it plays so well, I live with this. The Plasticover has almost reduced the chirp, although it returns instantly with a Cane reed.

shmuelyosef

11-09-2003, 04:48 AM

My Lamberson 7SB also has a tendency to chirp...mostly in the midrange (D2 --> G2). Anyone have a guess about why? I also live with it, because I just love the sound I can get. Haven't tried the Plasticovers, but I do use the Rico Royals...#3.

MojoBari

11-09-2003, 04:59 AM

shmuelyosef

11-10-2003, 07:12 AM

If you take in much mouthpiece with the Lamberson, you lose the richness in the midrange that is the hallmark of those pieces (IMHO). When I first started playing it, I kept subconsciously shifting embouchre as I played up and down the horn...almost became a habit before I caught myself...I've only had it 6 months, and I'm getting the hang of it..

MojoBari

11-10-2003, 01:37 PM

Probably true. But who needs rich sounding squeaks?

There is probably a good spot in the middle.

soreliprick

12-16-2003, 07:57 AM

My 'The Bari' came with a B5 Woodwind Co. Steel Ebonite vintage piece.
Can't ask for much more than that. I got a K6 with a '28 Buescher but 'The' doesn't cotton to it. It does work well on my '37 Searchlight. I ended up with a Guy Hawkins metal 8 on the Buescher, which also works well with both Martins. And they all are at least half up on the cork, and in tune.

MojoBari

12-16-2003, 02:08 PM

I finally got it: Sore Lip Rick! Anyone else been reading it wrong?

Merlin

12-16-2003, 03:27 PM

Hah!

I'd been reading "soreli prick"....

shmuelyosef

12-16-2003, 04:35 PM

Some players have a lot of trouble with high baffles near the tip rail. You can try other reed brands or taking in more mouthpiece and playing looser. If that doesn't work, and your sax is leak free, you can consider a mouthpiece tweek or change.

Recently tried a box of Alexander DCs with this piece and the chirp tendency has disappeared...it comes right back with the lavoz and ricos.

mark_m

12-16-2003, 11:24 PM

I always wondered about that name too. Throw some cap's in there SoreLipsRick would clarify! Very funny.

soreliprick

12-17-2003, 04:50 AM

How about a few caps for ''shmuelyosef''?!
I'm staying small until he clarifies.
Is that something nasty in Yiddish, or Ebonics?

shmuelyosef

12-17-2003, 06:19 PM

It's 'Hebonics'...ShmuelYosef pronounced shmoo'-el ya'-sef

It's basically the hebrew for Samuel Joseph (my grandfather) after whom I am named (in hebrew only and I share the initials)

...too much information

mark_m

01-07-2004, 05:37 PM

SoreLip - How are you liking that Guy Hawkins? I have an old one that was pretty beat, looked like someone might have filed on it a bit and the plating's 90% gone, but it really has some guts. Tended to be squealy though. Definitely on the wild side. It measures to be around a 9 'though it's marked 6 (and no I wasn't upside down when I was reading it:)

I took it in to local mouthpiece guy Jey Clark and he's cleaning it up and giving the tip some definition, hoping for a slightly tamed beast. Don't hear much talk about these pieces here, I find it a cool one...

soreliprick

01-09-2004, 10:46 PM

Thanks for adding the capital letters...i can't figure out how to change them in my handle. My Hawkins came from e#*& for a $60 bid after a friend pointed it out, with the original cap and lig. Its in great shape, never had anything done to it, no chirping or squealing. The Woodwinds do get deeper, but its a nice way to cut through. I thought Guy might be Coleman's brother, or Screamin Jay's namesake.

mark_m

01-13-2004, 05:22 PM

Got my GH back from Jey, and it plays great now, no problems. But I forgot (!) it really isn't quite large enough a chamber to go more than about 1/2" onto my The Martin neck. THAT was the reason I stopped playing it about a year ago.

If I only had a little more memory left... Well I guess I'll keep it in case I ever get an extended neck...

vick

01-13-2004, 07:08 PM

i just had the neck on my the martin extended and what a difference it made. i can now bring most of those sharp notes into tune and the mouthpiece is on there solid. definently worth the $25.

mark_m

01-13-2004, 07:14 PM

That's pretty enticing. And here I was thinking about a whole new custom neck. Well, I still am - I'm a bit shy to modify the original neck.

How much did you extend it by?

vick

01-15-2004, 03:41 AM

i extended it by a half inch, enough to hold the mouthpiece on but not too much so as to effect intonation. i had no reserves about extending the neck, but then again my the martin is already a beaten up frankenstein of a bari anyways. i think it was a much better deal than a whole new neck, but depending on how pristine your horn is, it might adversly effect resale value. but then again if the tech can put it on, i bet they could take it back off.

otomah

01-19-2004, 10:08 PM

Has anyone tried a morgan "vintage" model mouthpiece on a "The Martin"? I saw it junk dudes website and wondered if it was an attempt to solve some of the intonation problems discussed above.

Tom

ZenBen

01-19-2004, 10:31 PM

I find the discussion about where to put the mouthpiece on the neck on these Martin horns to be interesting. On my The Martin I put my rubber Link most of the way onto the cork to play in tune. I'm currently trying out a mid period rubber Berg 105/1 (that may be the only berg that is more open than its marking) and I have to push it on even further - just a hair past the cork.

mark_m

01-19-2004, 11:26 PM

That's the first I've heard of that! Wow. Does your neck match the horn's serial #? Any possibility the neck has already been extended?

Very interesting.

ZenBen

01-20-2004, 03:53 AM

There is no serial number on the neck. I can't say whether or not the neck is different from the original. It sure looks like it is the original. No extension on it, that's for sure. I like the sound of the Berg on it.

ninjameb

10-29-2004, 07:29 AM

how about a meyer 9M?

barisaxplayer

10-30-2004, 08:22 AM

I never thought of having that old martin's neck extended, I'll talk to the owner and have him give that a shot. Would help considering I had to have my link only about 1/4 in before it was close to playing in tune. Boy, did that cause problems! I wound up playing about 15C sharp most of the time!