Test drive: Buescher BU-6

[MPL]

Yep, I finally tried one. For those not familiar with this horn, it's a Selmer import from Taiwan, a clone of the SAII, and a couple of guys have given it decent reviews here at SOTW. It's marketed as a student horn, and is available from a variety of sources for $2300 and under.

And just for the sake of argument, I borrowed a friend's new pro-level Yanagisawa 991 to find out what the real differences are between them...other than cost, with the 991 available for $4200 and up.

Mechanically, the Buescher is...well, it's a student horn. It's simply less refined (i.e., cheaper) than the Yani. The keycup and keytouch edges feel generally rougher and less burnished on the BU-6. There are more visible solder spots on and around posts, although I was surprised that the Yani had as many as it did.

The key metal felt less sturdy and more easily bent on the Buescher, though not as bad as on my student Yamaha from 20 years ago. Those double arms on the Yani's low C and bell keys make a huge difference also.

Ergonomically, I thought the BU-6 was OK, but not in the same league as the Yani. The 991 was just too comfortable by comparison, though the Buescher wasn't bad at all, and does have an adjustable thumbrest. The pinky, palm & spatula keys all felt pretty good, with nothing unusual to report, though there was a lot of play in the low A key. I felt like I was bending something when pressing the key with emphasis. People with small hands (like me) beware: try it before you buy it!

The biggest surprise was in how the horn played. First I blew the 991 for a bit, and it responded exactly as expected: clean, round, easy, centered top to bottom on the horn. The only thing missing was personality, as you might expect from a low Bb horn. Ah, well, you can't have everything.

Then I played the BU-6. It too was clean, round, easy, centered top to bottom, and even a little darker and less edgy than the 991. I was quite surprised at this, as I had thought it would be a lot brighter, kind of like the Yamaha 52 is a brighter horn.

I ran the playing test with three different mouthpieces: my usual Meyer 6, a Runyon Custom 5, and an inexpensive Rico Royal Graftonite 7. Overall, the sound of the BU-6 compared extremely and surprisingly well to the 991. I was able to push the Buescher to get a little extra oomph, like you might need for R&B work, and the horn barked quite well. Intonation top to bottom was very close to the Yani as measured on my tuner.

The Buescher case was obviously cheap, with low-grade hardware and minimal protection inside. There's no slot or other place for the neck, so unless you put it in a Kiwi bag in the accessory compartment, it will get dinged up.

Overall, the BU-6 is a surprisingly good sounding horn. I think this would be a more than decent horn for someone who needs to double on baritone, but I don't think you'd want it as your main axe. The "polish" and refinements found on a pro-level instrument just aren't on the Buescher, and I think you definitely need to toss the stock case and get an aftermarket replacement case before you take the BU-6 on the road.

[Stencilman]

Thanks! I love these kinds of reviews. Wish we had more of them around here. Excellent!

[JPrince]

. The only thing missing was personality, as you might expect from a low Bb horn.

Ummm, what is this supposed to mean? I tend to find my Martin has a lot more personality than any Yamaha I have played. Then again I suppose it is a matter of opinion.

[MPL]

Nope...that's exactly what I mean. The Yani 991 is a beautiful low A horn, a gorgeous example of what you can get if you can afford the $4500 price tag...and it really sounds kind of bland next to a vintage low Bb Conn or Martin. The Yani would be the perfect horn for a studio pro who needs to blend in any kind of setting, but for solo work I'll stick to my 1967 Martin, thank you very much.

[JPrince]

OOPS! Sorry MPL, I read what you sai dwrong, lol. I read it as "The only thing missing was personality as you might expect from a low Bb horn" meaning that Bb horns don't have personality. Oops. Jeez, I was half asleep when I made that post. Sorry about that.

[super20dan]

any one who buys a buescher bu6deserves what he gets -a taiwanese peice of junk! money would be better spent on a vintage bari

[MPL]

Hey hey hey now, let's not start the flames again. There was a fellow who really tried to get me started the last time I asked about the BU-6 and the Vito VSP.

In the right circumstances, I'd recommend the BU-6. Like I said, someone who's doubling and can't really spend a bunch of cash might do all right by this horn. I don't think I'd tell a high school kid to run out and get one, and I doubt it can really stand up to the kind of abuse a school horn gets. But there's no way to tell that without a year-long test.

If you go vintage, as you and I do, that's great - but then you run into other issues, such as finding the right mouthpiece to get your ancient vessel to play in tune (without modifying the hardware, if you know what I mean!), or dealing with the old-fashioned ergonomics on the Conns, etc. So there's always a trade-off no matter what kind of horn you get. Some say the Keilwerth SX90 baris can't really make but one kind of sound, and that's it's not a terribly versatile horn - but if it makes the sound you want, what the heck!

From what I could tell, you'd absolutely have to baby a BU-6 to keep it in fighting trim...but it certainly sounded impressive to me. As for "piece of junk"...the Century baris I've seen ("Supervised by French Technicians!") were waaaaay worse.

[DaveKessler]

Any chance on trying it up against the B901?

We actually prefer the playability of the B901 over the B991 in our shop. Better price comparison as well ($3395 for a B901).

Just curious.

[Bootman]

Dan,
I tried a Taiwanese Bari yesterday that was playing great, it felt like a Yamaha, Selmer or Yani under the hands. The sound was good, intonation excellent but compared to the Conn Tranny, it was only a shadow.

The Low Bb bari is the way to go, they have the sound, the projection and the personality. There is no substitute.

[MPL]

It would be fun to test drive the BU-6 against a Yani 901...but no one I know around here owns one, and none of the local music stores has one. The closest approximation would be...yes, the Vito VSP, the 901's poor twin - which I tried out awhile back and was also very impressed with.

I did compare the BU-6 and 991 to my '67 Martin Committee, and I have to agree with Bootman on the sound. There's a presence that you get with a low Bb baritone that I've never heard from any low A horn, a thickness and richness to the sound that gives it more character. It's hard to define otherwise, since with a big mouthpiece you can get a louder noise from a low A baritone, so it's not just volume.

Now Bootman's got a Martin Magna with the low A, and he can vouch for its sonic qualities...trouble is, I'm not likely to find one in decent shape for a reasonable price. The word is out!

[Bootman]

The Conn is bigger and more complex than the Magna in terms of sound and pure horse power. The Low A and the Bottom end of the Magna is enormous, and the middle range doesn't suffer from any weakness or lack of power. The intonation is more flexible on the Low A bari's than on the low Bb Conn.

I took the magna out tonight and it played great, altissimo through bottom end, mid range you name it, the horn had it all except the overdrive and complexity of tonal colour that I can get with the Conn Tranny. The Magna Low A is nearly perfect but there is something about a Low Bb horn that will out hip a low A Bari every time.

I have played the magna against a Low A JK Black Nickel, the JK is a great horn but in terms of thunder, the Magna had it beat. The sound is very, very similar overall though with the Jk having the edge in ergonmics.

[super20dan]

mpl-how can you compare a vito VSP with a taiwanese made sax?the vsp is made by yani ! . not all saxes made in taiwan are junk but some are! a friend of mine bought a brand new bu6-(against my strong objestion) and was sorry to find out it was very poorly made and VERY flimsy. he ended up selling it and geting a vintage bari (conn) . for the price of a new bu6-one can buy a good restored vintage bari . i know what mods to make to a vintage bari to make it play with ANY MPC. and have tried (in vain!) to instill this knoweldge to othewr bari players here on this form.and bootman since all my current bari work is done standing up -i will agree that low Bb is the way to go. (this is a weighty isue)

[MPL]

The BU-6/VSP comparison came when I was looking for a horn - ANY horn - that had better ergonomics for me than my old Conn 12M (which, I must admit, I miss dearly. What a sound!), and which would fit into my available funds.

As it was, the VSP was still a too pricey for me at the time. So I ended up finding this Committee baritone and spending far too much money to get it overhauled. But now that I've had a chance to test my Martin against the almighty Yani 991, I have to say that I really do prefer the Martin sound. And I must be used to the keywork, because I don't have the tendinitis anymore.

And as for test driving horns: the best advice anyone gave me was to try as many horns as possible - regardless of make, model, or country of origin. You just can't tell whether a horn suits you until you play it. The BU-6 test drive cost me zero dollars, which was a bonus.

Dan, I respect your viewpoints on vintage axes. I don't agree with them - you'll never convince me to add tubing to a neck - but I respect them.

[MPL]

BTW...the fellow who flamed me on the VSP issue classified it as one of the "pieces of junk."

[David Spiegelthal]

I owned and regularly played (for about a year) one of the new Taiwan-made Buescher BU-6 baris, sold it on eBay a few months ago, now I play a mid-'50s vintage low-Bb Conn 12M. My opinion of the BU-6 is that it plays well except for a distinct lack of altissimo response; intonation is good; sound is pretty good but lacks a bit of warmth and color; attractively finished but rather cheaply made of flimsy metal (keywork and body both); keys bend very easily, and the body dents easily without any 'springback'. I had workmanship problems with mine (poor solder joints on the neck brace and neck socket); and yes, the case is El Cheapo --- the first thing I did after buying the horn was adding my own metal corners and rub strips to the outside of the case, and adding some foam inserts to the inside of the case as well as re-gluing almost all of the existing foam and wood blocks inside which were very loosely attached from the factory. Probably a good value for a new horn at the $2000 I paid for it, but no way should it be compared to a new pro horn, nor to a much more rugged higher-quality vintage horn. And so far, I don't really miss the lack of "low-A" capability, although I'd feel better having it there anyway.

[Storamin]

bootman since all my current bari work is done standing up -i will agree that low Bb is the way to go. (this is a weighty isue)
Low A is where it's at.

[Bootman]

Low A is totally unnecessary, it causes a lack of projection and presence in you sound. Accoustically you can't compete! A Low Bb model allows you to out grunt the trumpet player, the tenor player and bones too. You can do this with ease and usually need to hold back the amount of air you let out. It is an oppposite problem to the Low A projection problem.

I agree with Dan on the Bb issue but I have never needed to add tubing to my Bari necks to make them play in tune. The right choice of mpc can alleviate these problems.

The other thing is that a Low Bb is better balanced and you can stand a Conn Bari on any flat surface on the bell. :lol: :lol:

[super20dan]

mpl-your point is well taken. i can understand why one would be reluctant to alter a vintage horn but there is another way to accomplish the = of adding tubing to neck. the mpc can be extended . an extencion can be added to the shank of the mpc . may sound silly but it can be done

[MPL]

Now adding a shank to a mouthpiece makes more sense to me in that you're not performing any kind of "surgery" on the horn. I think someone mentioned in another message that Santy Runyon added a shank to a Custom to fix an intonation problem.

[philly_sax]

I'm glad my impression of the BU-6 is shared at least by MPL. I bought it new for $1839. The case is flimsy inside and out and I am careful withi it until I get time to reinforce or replace it. I bought this to double on bari on selected songs. Most of my playing is on tenor. I think the sound is surprisingly good for the price, but I agree that the ergonomics and perhaps sturdiness of the horn itself are lacking. It's tempting to not want to lug it around just for a few songs - I can produce a fairly good sounding and expressive bari sound with a Yamaha WX5 and VL-70m, but the "visual disconnect" is a minus. If you want to get inspired, watch the video of Tom Scott playing bari on "(Love is Like a)Heat Wave", in the movie "Standing in the Shadows of Motown". Nothin' like it.

[philly_sax]

Forgot to mention, the standard issue mouthpiece was not available, so they gave me a Berg Larsen 105/2, which I suspect helps a bit.

[super20dan]

still for 1900$ you could have got almost any vintage bari made (except selmer or the famous super20)and have a strong sturdy horn and one with resale value. i used to think some of these enexpencive tiawanese saxes were good value until i dropped mine on the carpet(a relatively minor fall )which resulted in an unbelievable anount of damage. you get what you pay for!

[Storamin]

Low A is totally unnecessary, it causes a lack of projection and presence in you sound. Accoustically you can't compete! A Low Bb model allows you to out grunt the trumpet player, the tenor player and bones too. You can do this with ease and usually need to hold back the amount of air you let out. It is an oppposite problem to the Low A projection problem.

I agree with Dan on the Bb issue but I have never needed to add tubing to my Bari necks to make them play in tune. The right choice of mpc can alleviate these problems.

The other thing is that a Low Bb is better balanced and you can stand a Conn Bari on any flat surface on the bell. :lol: :lol:
Then what genious started incorporating it? I'm not a sax history buff, but I love my Low A. I know that it was added later, but who made it and why? Why has it become so popular, and not an offshoot? Why don't we see low A tenors? Altos?

[MPL]

Hey, that's a good question. Whose idea was it originally to add the low A to a baritone? Since that gives the horn a low concert C, it sounds like it was only a metter of time before someone thought it would be useful.

I know Selmer made an alto with the low A...the photos were on Ebay awhile back, and I think that horn sold for well over $4000USD.