PLEASE post

[SAXYwkbrdr]

i'm in desperate need of advice on some saxes and personal experiences, reviews. I'm looking for an all black nickel or black nickel and silver plated alto saxophone or possibly a copper rose sax. I have found affordable models made by "saxophone.com" and "unison" also "antigua" I prefer julius keilwerth but am on a budget. Please share your opinions and experiences on the first three. THANK YOU

[Grey]

Why do you need a black horn? I know it's cool to have a good-looking horn, but it's the player, not the horn, man! None of the jazz greats had particularly nice-looking horns, but they were the best players in the world.

Now that my rant is done... If you still want a black horn, you might want to check out Cannonball saxes. They have a really nice Raven Finish. My friend has a soprano that's all black and it plays great and has a fantastic tone.

But you can get much better horns if you sacrifice the all-black look and just get a regular horn...

[SAXYwkbrdr]

thanks for the tip on cannonballs. also, i understand where you are coming from on your "rant" i also believe it is the musician not his instrument and personally have problems with peolple choosing anything because of looks over function. However, i've heard alot about the difference of the tone in the black nickel saxes (darker, as opposed to the brightness of say a silver sax) so i'd like to try one for myself and find out. thanks again

[Dave Dolson]

SAXY: There is a HUGE disagreement among us as to whether a horn's finish has any influence on how a particular horn sounds. You really should read through the site first. I believe there are no tonal differences attributed to finish. DAVE

[SAXYwkbrdr]

Dave,
thanks for your input and i understand that there is that disagreement and that is a large part of why i want to try another finish myself. I want to be my own musician and develop an opinion of my own on the matter. tonal difference or no, do you have any reccomendations for manufacturers and dealers? i've read some of your posts and you seem to be more than knowledgeable when dealing with saxophones and i respect your opinion, thanks

[Dave Dolson]

SAXY: Some folks like the Cannonballs. I'm not thrilled with the ones I've played, but they work. I also owned a gold-plated Unison alto for a while and it was a good player, especially for the price. I've tried a new Antigua alto and was not impressed - although it may well satisfy some buyers. I don't know if Kessler's saxophones come in black finishes, but you could ask. I recently bought a lacquered brass tenor from him that plays nicely.

As far as black finishes, I liked the looks of the Cannonball Raven - Scimonetti's in Lancaster, CA carries those. The Antigua soprano 586BN is gorgeous - I've played a good one and I've played one that didn't sound as good as the lacquered brass model next to it.

But as far as determining for yourself, I doubt if any testing you do will objectively decide it for you. Example - you go to a store, play three horns, all in the same finish, and each one is different. OR, you play three different horns and one sounds better than the others - it may be the black one, it may be the lacquered one. Who can really say if the finish is the reason? No one. It well could be the horn itself. DAVE

[tbone]

A black finish makes the horn sound darker and red paint makes your car go faster! Neither part makes much sense. Does black nickel make a difference from brite nickel? If plating really made a difference wouldn't the manufacturers be plating the inside of the horns? Is a blue horn better for the blues? Are funky hot finished horns better suited for rock and roll? It's the player, not the horn. Bird could wail on a Grafton and they were just crappy plastic. Take Dave's advise and get the best playing and sounding horn you can afford regardless of what color it is! 8-)

[SAXYwkbrdr]

Dave: thanks for clearing that up i guess i do just need to put on a blindfold and try some saxes.

tbone: your tone was a little sarcastic but i understand what you're saying

[larry]

This is what you really need:

[SAXYwkbrdr]

i dont think i could take myself seriously on that. However, "life is to important to take seriously" right? that is quite the sax for a 4th of july gig though.

[tbone]

tbone: your tone was a little sarcastic but i understand what you're saying

Gee, I really wasn't trying to be sarcastic. Sorry if it came off that way. I was merely trying to show the whole finish = certain tone for what it is. Weird science, myth, blind faith (not the rock band) & lunacy. 8-)

[SAXYwkbrdr]

there is a lot of lunacy in this world :D

thank y'all for your tips

[MikeCa]

I personally really like the Unison's. I have been selling them since they were a brand new company and each shipment seems to play better than the last. They keep refining what they are doing. The Antiguas I have never been that thrilled with or the Cannonballs they just don't seem to have as much tone as I get on the Unison. I know several good players though who have bought Cannonballs and think they're wonderful so I'd have to go along with the try as many as you can get your hands on. Of the Taiwanese horns I really like the Unisons the best and they are an incredible horn for the money.

I have also heard good things about Antigua, especially the Soprano.

I don't think you can go too wrong with any of these.

In the Unisons I really like look of the black finish with the engraving (Looks alone) better than the black with silver but that's also just subjective. The plating on the Unisons is excellent! Again I don't like the look of the Cannonballs as much as they are made to look aged (at least most of the ones I've seen). One other recommendation on the Unisons is to add a solid silver neck- opens up the sound even more.

Hope that helps a bit!

[sw3119]

If your looking for a 'Dark' horn (Tone wise) the MarkVII's are said to be dark and you can often pick one up used for the same price you are looking to pay for a sax.com or similar. I picked my VII alto up for $1100.

I also own a Sax.com silver alto (w/the clear lacquer) It's a good horn, well built and modeled after a Series II I believe. The tone is a little bit thinner than the Selmers that I have owned. Maybe I could do a little test tonight and play both the 7 and the .com with the same mpc and reed to see what the difference is.

My main complaint about the Sax.com horn is that I paid close to $1000 for it and now I would be lucky if I could sell if for $400. That is no exaggeration. The big brand name horns and vintage horns will hold a certain value. If you don't like it or decide to try something else you can always sell it for close to what your paid. The newer horns, like the Sax.com and others, are not an investment.

[SAXYwkbrdr]

thanks guys i think i may end up splurging on a Rampone and Cazzani