Sal Nistico's Setup

[John Robinson]

Does anyone know what mouthpiece Sal Nistico used on his old Conn? I love the richness and compactness he achieved - very close to what I'm tryiing for on tenor. I'm listening to "Empty Room" - that's the sound! Thanks!

[PB]

Hi John,
just search google for sal - there is a very interesting interview he did with Tubby Hayes in the mid 60s. They talk about their equipment, about Conn and Selmer and King, Berg Larsen and Otto Link.
At that time he played with Woody Herman and was a more agressive player. But just read it..............
P.S.: I own a copy of a workshop video he did in Amsterdam in 1990.
There he played on a gold-plated Selmer SSS with a new Otto Link MP.

[Tears June]

John Robinson

Check this:


http://www.jazzprofessional.com/Exchange/HayesNistico.htm

:cry:

[baribri]

During the years that Sal was first with Chuck Mangione and soon after with Woody in the early 60's he used a metal Link, a large tip around 8* and a Conn 10M tenor. Most of the recordings that we are all familiar with were done with that setup.

[Tim Price]

I studied with Sal- thru many years till he moved to Europe.
When I first knew him , in early 70s he used a metal Menza
mouthpiece...on his Conn with either Oliveri 4 reeds or Rico Royal4 reeds.
At that time Emilio overhauled the Conn. ( for free)
Sal then lived in NyC after and did stay Conn based till he found the Balanced Action.
Most of those Links he had either thru the Woody years etc were worked on by Frank Wells.
At a point in Europe he had a Guardala he bought from Bob Rockwell and used.I wonder IF that is the one on that RedRecords date?!
Sal was not lazy- He worked hard at his craft.His ears were like radar.
His articulation and speed were hand in hand with a superior mind.
I saw Sal play the Trane Giant Staps solo faster than the record using his own articulations-IT WAS UNREAL :roll:
He used that Menza mouthpiece on those Woody sides on Chess that were from early 70s.Once I heard him at "Lennys On The Turnpike"
with Jaki Byard, Harvie Swartz,Alan Dawson....what a band!!!!!!!!!!
Nobody had Sals time feel- and his rapid fire chops.
I have one of his solos in my "Great Tenor Solos" book pub thru Hal Leonard.
I really miss Sal- he was a true artist.What he played came from the heart and soul.

[CashSax]

I agree totally with Tim, Sal would make a lot of todays "stars" sound rather bland..The man was from another world when he turned it on..

[saxtek]

Sal made a big impression on me when he was with Woody in the early 1960s. I was very lucky to hear him live and up close at a dance in Dayton Ohio with Woody, and a few months later with Count Basie in Troy Ohio.

Sal was using a metal Otto Link Super Tone Master on a Conn in those days. Early 60s Links were great mouthpieces. If Sal had his Link mouthpieces altered by Frank Wells, I know Frank's usual procedure. The biggest change was to "square off" the inside of the tip of the Otto Link metal mouthpiece, making a short "shelf" baffle about 1/8" - 1/4" behind the tip rail. Frank's Otto Link alterations didn't play much different from a good stock Otto Link. The real source of Sal Nistico's sound was Sal.

I studied with Sal- thru many years till he moved to Europe.
When I first knew him , in early 70s he used a metal Menza
mouthpiece...on his Conn with either Oliveri 4 reeds or Rico Royal4 reeds.
At that time Emilio overhauled the Conn. ( for free)
Sal then lived in NyC after and did stay Conn based till he found the Balanced Action.
Most of those Links he had either thru the Woody years etc were worked on by Frank Wells.

[warp x]

I seem to remember he was still playing the Conn when he was my teacher in the early nineties. Or maybe it was the SSS. I don't remember the mouthpiece.

[Bob M]

FWIW, pictorial evidence on the back cover of the "Empty Room" CD (he is pictured with the band on the recording) shows Sal playing a silverplated 10M (can't really tell what the mouthpiece is from the picture). So it looks like he went back to a 10M late in life. BTW, there is version of Inner Urge on that CD which BURNS. He takes it at a much faster tempo than any other recording that I've heard.

I have also seen pictures of him playing a Couf Superba 1 and a Selmer Super/Radio Improved.

[RICHARD GARCIA]

I was fortunate to see Sal play several times up close, and I was amazed to see how little of the mouthpiece he took in. I only saw him play a Link and he played right on the tip. He was probably to most woodwind teachers what Dizzy was to trumpet teachers. His sound was great and his technique was ferocious. Everytime I saw him he would do a feature in which they would play a tune at an unbelievable tempo and the band would fall out while he continued playing unaccompanied through the changes, and just BURN, while playing an absolute endless waterfall of ideas. He was just overwhelming.

[soybean]

His articulation and speed were hand in hand with a superior mind. I saw Sal play the Trane Giant Staps solo faster than the record using his own articulations-…Tim, were you able to analyze why his articulation was so good? For example, did he have different tongue-ing patterns than most saxophone players and what were they? :D

[kevvieg]

Woody Herman 1963 Phillips - Sister Sadie: Forever changed my conception of what a great tenor player sounds like. Before that I was into Getz, Zoot, etc. (Still am FWIW) But Sal was in the same league as Phil Woods and Don Menza and Johnny Griffin in terms of complete control of his instrument. When I first heard Nick Brignola, I though of him being more like a lower-register Sal Nistico or Phil Woods than like any other bari player I'd ever heard. Then I found out that sal & Nick had worked together and were both from upstate NY and it all made sense.

What is it about upstate New York that it bred guys like Menza, Nistico, Brignola, Joe Romano, etc. Is it the passionate Italian thing or is there something in the water LOL?

[Tim Price]

Tim, were you able to analyze why his articulation was so good? For example, did he have different tongue-ing patterns than most saxophone players and what were they? :D


Soy ~ For starters read this please ;
http://www.saxontheweb.net/Price/DoubleTonguing.html

What Sal has was gained thru hard work & one of the most natural " time feels" ever on a tenor sax. ( sans and with guys like Johnny Griffin or Moody )

It was the combination of TIME with his great ability to _place_the articulation on the time.
Eg; http://www.timpricejazz.com/lessons/SalNistico.pdf

Or;
http://www.timpricejazz.com/lessons/SalNistico.pdf

Listen to his great note choice too. If you want you should transcribe the solos on" Heavyweights" his debut record produced by Cannonball. Talk about a REAL talented/deserving YOUNG LION. That, was Sal.:D
m/Heavyweights-Comin-Up-Sal-Nistico/dp/B000063DIM/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=music&qid=1222128256&sr=1-1

Also in my book - " GREAT TENOR SOLOS"......:D8-)
Pub by Hal Leonard- I have a Sal solo on " Fei Fi Fo Fum". From his Beehive record. Try to hear the vinal, and study the transcription.
Get it here'
http://www.amazon.com/Great-Tenor-Solos-Product-673254/dp/079353674X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1222128545&sr=1-1 < also in that book is- St. Thomas (Sonny Rollins) * Body and Soul (Coleman Hawkins) * Lester Leaps In (Lester Young) * Parker 51 (Stan Getz) * Tune Up ( Stitt) * Bye Bye Blues (Lew Tabackin) * I'm Old Fashioned (Pete Christlieb) * Bye Bye Blackbird (John Coltrane) * and an introduction and notes about each piece, by yours truly.


I think it does Sal justice cuz' I know he was happy with that solo on that LP. He told me he thought he got it on that.

If your a Sal fanatic like me.....you might _NEED_to have "Porter-Praskin Quartet with Sal Nestico" called SONNET FOR SAL that is beautiful- Plus Alan Praskin kicks *** on it. no alto player sounds like Praskin..:D.. It's Enja CD 8026-2 - LOOK HARD.

Players/ students need to ..MAKE IT THEIR BUSINESS...to know everything Sal did. If not, your shorting yourself out.Many of the new players are fun and great to listen to and dig, but SAL NISTICO is a man who laid down history and a message everytime he blew.

Sal taught me to focus on the way in which I could effectively internalize explicit knowledge and direct it into the knowledge of playing on the bandstand. Thereby enhancing the my instant knowledge and internalization. Something a "tad" different than Kenny Werners book, but in the same sector.
< Kenny had no book at that time BTW, but that is not the point - lol >

Sal also knew ever part in the DON ELLIS tenor book he played, note for note. He could exp;ain the " time" feels of Ellis music. During the lessons I had with him, he insisted I never write anything down. His point was pretty blunt, if you want to remember it- YOU WILL. One of the coolest gigs I ever played with organist Don Patterson in PHILLY in the early 80's....at the KINGS ROOK in West Philly, deep in the hood. But a real jazz club- 5 nights of 4 sets a night gigs. One night, some moron was playing a PAC MAN game machine. This tells ya with the PAC MAN thing the era , so this noise is really a drag from the PAC MAN thing, and it starts during one of Sals ballads. Sal freaks out, and sais to me " cover the tune" .... " TILL I STRAIGHTEN THIS FOOL OUT " ....So Sal, puts his horn down on the Hammond Leslie speaker goes over to the guy playing the damn game and pulls the cord out of the wall and the machine ; AT THE SAME TIME !!!!! Then Sal sais to the guy- GAME OVER MF'er. hahaha ~:D And goes back on the stand and takes care of biz'. LOL.
I'm tellin ya- WHAT A PRO !!! I'll never forget that one. EVER!!!
Sal was a trip. During that week he turned me on to a drink he called a Boscov Petrovich. It was white wine and apple juice. Boscov was a vibes player Sal knew BTW, Those days Philly had over 26 clubs cookin'. Great spots with guys like Rudy Jones- tenor, Vance Wilson- tenor, Charles Bowen-tenor. Plus the great JOHN GLENN, on bari or tenor and alto. Glenn was mentioned in the Coltrane book- and quite the burning cat. In the NYC day, he was a Ponty repair guy, but he could get up in there as great as anyone ever. Then also there was, The Grubbs Brothers, Jesse Morrison plus Bobby Brown. ALL GREAT SAX PLAYERS - and knew the music from the soul out. Guys like Julian Pressly was playing with drum legend Edgar Bateman, and when I first heard Julian I was in shock. One of the most explicit alto players and a stand up brilliant musician. A great buddy as years went on too, my man Julian. Philly was like that then- you could find Mobley over off South St on Saturdays in the bar drinking 8 oz Miller beers and talking with the neighborhood cats about what number came up or where the World Series might be. A lot of those guys came by to hear Sal too cuz he was so lethal.
What a great time period. WOW- :)

Yea- Sal was a master and most of all a brilliant guy. It was an honor to have him for a friend- and teacher at those points in life. I think of him every day.

Hope I didn't bore ya- this is some life stuff too.

ENJOY- 8-)

[DD]

In listening to early Sal with the Mangione brothers groups of the '59 -'60 era, it was apparent the rhythmic patterns of the original bop lines they were doing were certainly central to Sal's improvisational idiom. Whether that was Gap, Chuck or Sal's doing is anyone's guess, but it certainly translated well when Sal did his Riverside recordings and went onto the Woody band.

Anyone at the Berklee dorm the Summer of '64 got constant ear-lessons (at least on the 2nd floor) as Sal was always on my old Webcor phono. He was an early influence on my playing, and a reminder throughout his (recorded) career of what was possible.

Saw him live only one time, with Woody at a policeman's ball in Washington PA @ 1965. One set in and the band looked totally bored, so we approached Nat Pierce and recommended they play some of the recorded stuff. They were hesitant but shifted gears, and tore the place up for the next two hours.

His early stuff was done on a 10m with a Berg metal, size not known to me, but sounds like 105/110 ish. Tim?

[Bob M]

Tim -

Thanks for your personal comments and insights on Sal Nistico. Your general love of all things Saxophone is infectious and particularly so in the case of Nistico. As a result, a lot of my "ear time" has been spent listening ("Sister Sadie" just blows me away, as does his version of "Inner Urge" on Empty Room) and working on your ii-V7-I "Sal Lessons". Great stuff for the ears and fingers!

Also, soybean's question was one of the better ones that I have seen on SOTW Forum and your comments on double tonguing will provide me with some good work too. I'd be curious to know who Sal liked to listen to...who were HIS idols?

[soybean]

Tim, thanks for the entertaining and informative answer. You should write a book! I will be checking out the record produced by Cannonball.

[Tim Price]

In listening to early Sal with the Mangione brothers groups of the '59 -'60 era, it was apparent the rhythmic patterns of the original bop lines they were doing were certainly central to Sal's improvisational idiom. Whether that was Gap, Chuck or Sal's doing is anyone's guess, but it certainly translated well when Sal did his Riverside recordings and went onto the Woody band.

Anyone at the Berklee dorm the Summer of '64 got constant ear-lessons (at least on the 2nd floor) as Sal was always on my old Webcor phono. He was an early influence on my playing, and a reminder throughout his (recorded) career of what was possible.

Saw him live only one time, with Woody at a policeman's ball in Washington PA @ 1965. One set in and the band looked totally bored, so we approached Nat Pierce and recommended they play some of the recorded stuff. They were hesitant but shifted gears, and tore the place up for the next two hours.

His early stuff was done on a 10m with a Berg metal, size not known to me, but sounds like 105/110 ish. Tim?



I WISH I KNEW DD.:)

It mighta been an older Berg al@ Wardell. Maybe....;)

[Tim Price]

Tim, thanks for the entertaining and informative answer. You should write a book! I will be checking out the record produced by Cannonball.


Soy- Keep us posted on your thoughts ok?!8-)

[Tim Price]

Tim -

Thanks for your personal comments and insights on Sal Nistico. Your general love of all things Saxophone is infectious and particularly so in the case of Nistico. As a result, a lot of my "ear time" has been spent listening ("Sister Sadie" just blows me away, as does his version of "Inner Urge" on Empty Room) and working on your ii-V7-I "Sal Lessons". Great stuff for the ears and fingers!
Also, soybean's question was one of the better ones that I have seen on SOTW Forum and your comments on double tonguing will provide me with some good work too. I'd be curious to know who Sal liked to listen to...who were HIS idols?

Bob- Thank you...really I'm glad I went the direction I did. Sal was a great friend, loved dearly by me and a zillion others. There's some big band Clarke-Boland with Sal & Tony Coe etc. Coe plays alto as a dep for Derek Humble.
Sal _KNEW_how to make a big band solo his own. History shows the results.

Sal loved guys like Jug and Rollins. He loved to "hang " too- we went to see GATO once at JazzWorkshop in Boston. Sal dug him- matter of fact at a point in Sals in-out of Woodys gig....he was jamming on Prince St in NYC IN THE MID-60S with Ornette. BUT~On Bari sax.:shock::D:) It was Sal who hipped me to the Couf bari BTW. I used that Couf of mine for years, it cost 900 bucks from Zapfs Music in Philly. In mid 70's. But also Sal had a memory that was NON STOP. Sal loved Griff, Joe Alexander,Cuber, Trane, Stitt and Bird. His heart was big. Sal also was in the Don Ellis band with John Klemmer for a few gigs and spoke VERY highly of his work.
Once Sal was on a NYC subway- and Trane was there. Trane saw Sal & walked over and told him he was a big fan of Sals style. Sal told me he was so stunned that he probally was on that train in shock for a few extra stops till he came back to earth. I think Sal shedded with Trane at the L.I pad of Trane. Because Sal mentioned that he used to be friendly with Trane. I know Ravi pretty well and know Ravi has mentioned Sal in refrence to his dad. But Sal, man....nobody ever played like that. EVER!!!!

Sal spoke of Menza lovingly and of course Joe Romano a lot. And he hipped me to JR Monterose. And the articulation thing they -HEARD.

Sal had a soul and Sal had a heart.
Any student, or friend that has been in my PA studio in my home has seen the framed poster print from Sals memorial above my music stand. Anyone from a 4th grader to a collEge player/semi pro adult knows who Sal is immediatly if they didn't already. HE IS THE MAN.

[DD]

Recently saw this Sal video and a few others on Youtube...listen, learn and enjoy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bxLTBi9fHeo

[LiAm84]

Recently saw this Sal video and a few others on Youtube...listen, learn and enjoy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bxLTBi9fHeo

Thanks for sharing! Great video. It's the Conn 10m + Berg set-up! Nice8-)

[sonnymobleytrane]

To my ears Sal had one of the best tenor sounds ever!!!

[oversaxedman]

I am sorry I didn't discover Sal to just recently,does anyone know what year 10m did he play?

[jaythomas]

I knew Sal quite well...and I saw him always on a metal link....he played my horn one time at a session and he played my 7* and sounded exactly the same as ever.
On the famous stuff Sister Sadie etc. he played 10m and link...i doubt if it was that big...in fact i could almost swear it was a 7 or 7* ...we played and hung a bunch....he was gruff on the exterior but a real sensitive guy on when you got to know him. I was hanging with him when he was playing with Chet...he was a little afraid of Chet becuase he never quite nknew what chet was going to call...one night at the blue note he was bemoaning the fact that Chet clalled Stella in A or G
Sal had that R&B background and could really relax his embrochure and over blow the horn to get it into hyper drive...plus Conns have such a big sound and quick response. I spent many afternoons with him and Schnitter...as in Davey.
As for some of the later stuff he was going thru a lot of sould searching...he did'nt want to sound the way that he used too and gear was really changing for a while in the 70's....I saw a video of later Sal and he was playing some other mpc...but truth be known I liked him on link best....I was working with Jake Hanna when Sal died and Jake said about Sal...." he had perfect time"

[jaythomas]

sorry back again....hmmmm...Berg....I dont think I ever saw him with a Berg...his sound was a classic link sound ala Tubby at his best and Gonsalves and Lockjaw Griffin etc.

[sideC]

Tim, thank you for the kind words, and be sure to include yourself when you mention players who are really saying something and swinging. You tell the truth, and it comes out of your horn!

Back to the thread. I'm really envious of Tim and jaythomas and anyone else who got to stand next to Sal Nistico. I never got the chance to play music with him, or even hear him play live for that matter. If you've never heard him, check him out and then you can appreciate the kind of courage it takes to stand next to him. I saw him on tv, with Woody's band a few times, and once with a small group fronted by Buddy Rich. Buddy's band used a 2 saxophone front line, Sal on tenor and Sonny Fortune on alto. Too bad Buddy couldn't get 2 GOOD saxophone players!!! Ha ha ha ha.

What I remember from the tv was that Sal had this pinpoint laser accuracy at super high speed that was quite intimidating. He was really burning, but he seemed to be very to the point, and getting things done, not just blowing a lot of random notes. He seemed to really mean business. His sound didn't seem to be very flowery or showy, but seemed to have a fat, muscular quality. And I admired the personal intensity that he had when he played the horn, he seemed to be a no nonsense player. I know I could have learned a lot from playing with him.

[Rufusax]

I studied with Sal- thru many years till he moved to Europe.
When I first knew him , in early 70s he used a metal Menza
mouthpiece...on his Conn with either Oliveri 4 reeds or Rico Royal4 reeds.
At that time Emilio overhauled the Conn. ( for free)
Sal then lived in NyC after and did stay Conn based till he found the Balanced Action.
Most of those Links he had either thru the Woody years etc were worked on by Frank Wells.
At a point in Europe he had a Guardala he bought from Bob Rockwell and used.I wonder IF that is the one on that RedRecords date?!
Sal was not lazy- He worked hard at his craft.His ears were like radar.
His articulation and speed were hand in hand with a superior mind.
I saw Sal play the Trane Giant Staps solo faster than the record using his own articulations-IT WAS UNREAL :roll:
He used that Menza mouthpiece on those Woody sides on Chess that were from early 70s.Once I heard him at "Lennys On The Turnpike"
with Jaki Byard, Harvie Swartz,Alan Dawson....what a band!!!!!!!!!!
Nobody had Sals time feel- and his rapid fire chops.
I have one of his solos in my "Great Tenor Solos" book pub thru Hal Leonard.
I really miss Sal- he was a true artist.What he played came from the heart and soul.
Tim, what was the 60s Woody album with that lightspeed take of Caldonia? thats one of the most intense solos i've ever heard................................

[saxtek]

The original LP recording is "Woody Herman - Encore 1963"

Unfortunately the CD currently available under that name is a reissue of the "Woody Herman 1963" recording, a great CD but not the live recording with Caldonia.

Mosaic has a boxed set of Woody recordings from the 60's that has everything, including Caldonia.