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View Full Version : Grassi Professional 2000 Tenor - Any good?



Di
02-06-2005, 04:36 PM
Hi
Can anyone tell me if the Grassi 2000 is a good instrument? Is it a student or intermediate horn?
Thanks
Di

JMac
02-07-2005, 06:37 PM
Hey, Di- The search button isn't working too well here with all the recent "issues" - but here is a link to a previous discussion on Italian Horn manufacturers - http://www.saxontheweb.net/sotw/viewtopic.php?t=1141 . Cuthbert, in the 3rd post on this thread says...

Grassi:sadly,what was the best sax factory in Italy shut down in 2000.Lady Grassi was very old ,around the 90s,and she wasn't able to carry on.Nobody of their nephews wanted to be involved in the enterprise so it died.If it's sadly enough,it closed when started the production of the last and the best sax by Grassi,the Professional 2000.I tried it along with a Selmer IIIrd series and it was MUCH MUCH better.If you find one,purchase it!The other instruments were the leader (don't be fooled by the name,a student model) equipareble to the Yamaha 52,and the old Prestige,professional model good but not special.The older model are very well done but nothing more than Selmer mk VI copies.

I have a Mk VI tenor copy which will be going on e-bay soon (baby on the way). I have seen 3 or 4 of the 2000 horns on e-bay, and they mostly seem to have been in the isles. Looks like they are pretty good pro-level horns, and great for the money!

Best of luck and let us know how it turns out! - Jeff

mountainman
02-07-2005, 09:51 PM
Not a bad horn. I played one for many years before upping to a B&S 2001. I would consider it intermediate. I still like my Grassi Bari. Also have a Grassi Alto. mountainman

Captain Beeflat
02-10-2005, 05:34 PM
I have a Grassi 2000 tenor, which, as we all know, is an un-ashamed copy of the Selmer; frankly I have found it to be just as good at a fraction of the price. It's keywork, intonation and sound are superb; as good as any Selmer that I have owned or played. Not quite as good as my R1 R&C but what is?
As the "professional 2000" was the swansong of Grassi, there will, regretably, be no more produced, so, if you are thinking of buying a Selmer then I would strongly recommend trying a Grassi 2000 if you can find one.

The A Train
04-15-2005, 03:31 AM
I just picked up a Grassi 2000 on ebay for $700. I also own a Medusa and I gotta tell you the Grassi can hold its own with the snake-haired lady and even has an edge to it that she does not..at a fraction of the cost.

Captain Beeflat
04-19-2005, 01:36 PM
Told you so....:-)

rispoli
04-21-2005, 04:44 PM
I am going to Italy in 2 weeks and I am in talks with a guy who is selling a tenor Grassi. He claims it is a 2000 model, however in the not so good pictures he sent me it is shown with nickel keys, something I would not expect from a saxophone that claims to be a professional model. He claims not to be an expert of saxophones (just a beginner who gave up soon).
May anybody here tell me if that is correct for a Grassi 2000 or he's misleading me? Is there a mark on the lower part of the sax as in most brand name models?
In alternative to that I could pick up an EX-90 which looks new (for 800 euros wouldn't be bad I think).

Thanks everyone!

rsclosson
04-21-2005, 05:05 PM
Do not be too put off with the keys. Pro horns with nickel keys are more common in Europe. I have a Keilwerth New King stencil with nickel keys. Great horn.

Captain Beeflat
04-21-2005, 05:13 PM
Rispoli.
My Grassi 2000, & all the others that I have seen, have lacquered brass keywork. Ask the vendor if "Professional 2000" is engraved on the horn; it should be.

rispoli
04-21-2005, 06:25 PM
Thanks a lot Captain, your reply is greatly appreciated, confirms all my doubts. On the bell there is nothing more than the Grassi logo, so it is not a 2000 Professional. The guy won't accept returns, so I won't go for it because the older Grassi models do not interest me (I already have a B&S 2001, got spoiled...).

Thanks!!!

Captain Beeflat
04-22-2005, 11:01 AM
Rispoli.
Although the EX-90 is a very good horn, I would strongly recommend that you try a Grassi 2000 before buying. Remember that no more Grassis will be built!

rispoli
04-22-2005, 07:11 PM
Captain, the Grassi professional 2000 would be indeed my first choice, foremost for what I read here on SOTW: if it really sounds somehow like the Mark 6 it could also replace my beloved B&S 2001 as my first sax! However there are few around, I guess, probably mostly in Italy. I have 2 more weeks of hunt before I get there for a few days.

Regarding the EX-90, I never played it but if it comes close, not equal, to the SX-90, which I tried, I would be extremely happy with that too.

Thanks for your advises.

The A Train
04-22-2005, 10:25 PM
Cap, the Grassi I got on ebay is all gold laquered and has ribbed construction and was listed as the professional but it is not stamped 'Professional 2000' just 'Model 2000' So..do I or don't I have a pro model?

Captain Beeflat
04-23-2005, 02:18 PM
Medusa Man.
I honestly do not know, & as the facory has shut, who can we ask? All I know is that my horn says "Professional 2000" stamped on it.
It could be that your horn is identical & at some time in the production run they engraved the word "professional" perhaps to add a little kudos.
Perhaps the cognoscenti in Italy can come up with a definative answer.

The A Train
04-23-2005, 02:57 PM
B-would you be able to post a couple pics for comparison?..or send to my email? medusaman@verizon.net Thanx,
Alan

The A Train
04-24-2005, 08:41 PM
Captain I believe your right. Apon request I received a complete set of pics from a gent with a Grassi Professional 2000 alto on ebay and the only difference(beside the fact that mine is tenor) is the word 'Professional' in the place of the word 'Model' above the 2000. Everything else about the two horns is identical..Grassi must have decided somewhere along the prodution run to change it.....I would still like to see pics of the new engraving when you get yours back. :)

Captain Beeflat
04-25-2005, 01:40 PM
Medusa Man.
Great, I am delighted for you. You have a lovely horn there. Of course I will send you photographs of my 2000 when the engraver finishes with it.

mountainman
04-26-2005, 02:54 PM
I have moved from Conn to Grassi to B&S 2001 to JK SX90R Shadow over the last 50years. All were chosen over Mark VI's and new Selmers. Four years ago I chose the B&S over the JK SX90 it being close soundwise and mechanically and did not think the JK worth the extra expense. After playing the new JK for 2 months I went back and played the B&S and I noticed quite a difference in the mechanical precision. speciffically the tightness and smoothness of the action. This was not a function of wear but of design. Not much can touch either horn.

MMM
05-19-2005, 02:26 PM
I believe the models 2000 and Professional 2000 are one and the same, this was meant to be the intermediate model (I know there is some disagreement on this). The top of the range was the Prestige in 24K gold plate. From what I hear they are/were underrated, but were too expensive when in production (bit like current Borganis!) to really take off. I have yet to try one....from the reviews in this thread, I'd love to try one.

All the best,
M

stolenzephyr
06-15-2007, 10:34 AM
I have located one of these saxes and need a little bit of info before this evening!

If any of you guys have this horn could you tell me if your markings are the same or similar to these?

http://i22.ebayimg.com/05/i/000/a3/53/67a5_1.JPG

Captain Beeflat
06-15-2007, 12:17 PM
stolenzephyr.
Yes..."Professional 2000", exactly like mine. Having played only one I cannot speak about the consistency one to the other. All I can say is that mine is the equal, or better than, any Mk6 that I have owned or played.
Does "yours" have high F#...mine does not.

stolenzephyr
06-15-2007, 12:29 PM
Bb.
I have just checked and can confirm that it does NOT have the high f# key. what would be the difference if it was on the instrument?

I'm slightly wary because the only info I can find online is in this sax forum. What do you think would be a reasonable price to pay for one of these instruments in reasonable condition?

What serial number is yours?

p.s. I sent you a PM i hope you don't mind!

wmclean
06-16-2007, 01:52 AM
I recently picked up a Grassi Professional 2000 Tenor from ebay in Italy and had it shipped to Canada for under $600 ...

W

The A Train
06-19-2007, 10:54 PM
Anyone ever heard of the 'Jade Series'? Here is one on ebay: http://cgi.ebay.com/Ida-Maria-Grassi-Italy-Professional-Tenor-Saxophone_W0QQitemZ180131537767QQihZ008QQcategoryZ16234QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Captain Beeflat
06-20-2007, 10:50 AM
Alan. Thanks for that; a very nice looking horn. The script says everything that we have been saying...

stolenzephyr
06-20-2007, 10:53 AM
I'm very pleased with my Grassi professional 2000 so far, the sound is excellent.

Just a few bits not quite right, the octave mechanism needs some attention and one of the guards on the low c pad has come unattatched where it was soldered on one side. Shouldn't be too hard to fix, I'll just put it through a service.

That jade sax looks really nice.

Captain Beeflat
06-20-2007, 12:28 PM
Seems a shame that the "jade" theme did not extend to the key pearls.

stolenzephyr. May I suggest that you try a very open Rico Metalite mouthpiece on your Grassi. I have a shedful of expensive mouthpieces but nothing comes close to the Metalite...at least, on the Grassi. I believe that the only fault with the Metalite (apart from it's appearance) was the fact that it was so cheap; no-one wants to be seen as a cheapskate.
Everyone knows that the quality, and sound, of a mouthpiece is directly proportional to it's price. :-)

stolenzephyr
06-20-2007, 12:39 PM
Seems a shame that the "jade" theme did not extend to the key pearls.

stolenzephyr. May I suggest that you try a very open Rico Metalite mouthpiece on your Grassi. I have a shedful of expensive mouthpieces but nothing comes close to the Metalite...at least, on the Grassi. I believe that the only fault with the Metalite (apart from it's appearance) was the fact that it was so cheap; no-one wants to be seen as a cheapskate.
Everyone knows that the quality, and sound, of a mouthpiece is directly proportional to it's price. :-)

I have been searching for one of these mouthpieces online but noone seems to stock them, a trip to my local woodwind shop is in order this lunchtime.

Just to let you know, the police found my car, not TOO damaged (will need new door/steering column but not much else) so i'm relieved, though the sax wasn't in the back, they WILL be able to get some prints. fingers crossed!

The A Train
06-20-2007, 01:08 PM
I wonder what model that jade tenor is, he never said it was a Professional 2000.
I continue to be surprised at the number of you that have the P 2000 that do not have a high F# key and yet my "Model 2000" does..also..I've had and tried Metalites on my horns and didn't like them..recently sold an M9 to John Laughter,.he now has it up on Ebay for $50, so I guess he didn't like it either.

Captain Beeflat
06-20-2007, 01:47 PM
A Train.
Yes...A history of the Grassi is required; if for no better reason than to sort out the confusing model names.
I have contacted the seller of the "Jade" to ask him the model name.
Fully understand how you dislike the Metalite but it really depends upon your playing style. I play with amplified guitars where it is ideal; although it can be played softly for ballads; anyway, yours was the girlie M9!

Captain Beeflat
06-20-2007, 01:58 PM
stolenzephr
Relatively good news about plod finding your car. I do hope that they catch the lowlife thieves and recover your horn.

A Train. I cannot find John Laughter's Metalite on ebay.

stolenzephyr
06-20-2007, 02:04 PM
A Grassi history would be good to know. Especially all the models and stuff.

Bb you say your sax has fancy keys, mine doesn't. Some photos of people's instruments would be interesting to compare don't you think?

managed to track down one of those metalite mouthpieces, going to try it later and see what I think.

Captain Beeflat
06-20-2007, 02:16 PM
stolenzephyr.
Nothing fancy about my keys; simply that they are gold colour as distinct from your nickel plate....another major discrepancy between horns with the same model number!
Where did you find the Metalite? What number? Look forward to your impressions.
A photograph of my horn would serve no purpose as I have de-lacquered it and carved the word Grassi in graffiti script out of a silver sheet and attached it to the front of the bell....I was fed up with it being mistaken for a Selmer. :-)

Captain Beeflat
06-20-2007, 05:20 PM
This is the result of my enquiry to the ebay seller of the "Jade"...sounds interesting:-
Thank you for your interest in the Grassi Pro Tenor; this horn is probaly from the 1960s, and the Prestige & 2000 models were made decades later; thus, none of the characteristic writing below the thumbrest, that we see in the later models, is present. I had a Prestige last year, and it was great; the horns are similar in tone, although they are separated by decades of manufacturing. Have a pleasant day.
I, for one, would like it.

stolenzephyr
06-20-2007, 05:23 PM
stolenzephyr.
Nothing fancy about my keys; simply that they are gold colour as distinct from your nickel plate....another major discrepancy between horns with the same model number!
Where did you find the Metalite? What number? Look forward to your impressions.
A photograph of my horn would serve no purpose as I have de-lacquered it and carved the word Grassi in graffiti script out of a silver sheet and attached it to the front of the bell....I was fed up with it being mistaken for a Selmer. :-)

The metalites were in a local music store in Bristol. They have a 9 and an 11 at the back of a cupboard they never sold. I'm going to try both of them out when it's been serviced.

The fact you have butchered your Grassi makes me want to see it even more!

Captain Beeflat
06-20-2007, 05:31 PM
My "butchered" Grassi is currently in bits on the kitchen table awaiting a set of hard pads from Windcraft.
I will PM a photograph to you when it is up and running again.
If you do decide against the No. 11 Metalite, please let me know where it is....I would like to have it opened to about 0.035".

Captain Beeflat
06-20-2007, 05:37 PM
stolenzephyr.
I forgot to mention the added butchery of being elaborately hand engraved on the bell interior and the crook!

The A Train
06-21-2007, 12:56 PM
Cap -
http://cgi.ebay.com/Rico-Metalite-Tenor-Saxophone-mouthpiece-M9_W0QQitemZ160128861762QQihZ006QQcategoryZ38112QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Captain Beeflat
06-21-2007, 01:00 PM
A Train.
Thanks.
Point of interest, why did you not like it please; do you play "classical" sax? :-)

stolenzephyr
06-21-2007, 01:05 PM
My "butchered" Grassi is currently in bits on the kitchen table awaiting a set of hard pads from Windcraft.
I will PM a photograph to you when it is up and running again.
If you do decide against the No. 11 Metalite, please let me know where it is....I would like to have it opened to about 0.035".
I'm going back on tuesday so I will let you know, I can check if they have any more too.

Captain Beeflat
06-21-2007, 01:12 PM
Many thanks stolenzephyr but an old pal saw this thread and he has an unused No.11...that is the easier route.

The A Train
06-21-2007, 02:34 PM
A Train.
Thanks.
Point of interest, why did you not like it please; do you play "classical" sax? :-)
You do know this is Alan -formally Medusaman, right? You've heard my stuff, hardly classical and I am just a player for fun -certainly no pro. Here is something i did recently, it starts out slow but picks up:
http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=5421158&q=hi
That was done using a S/S Brilhart Levelaire 6* that I ground the bite plate down on but hadn't played much. Answer to your question - I didn't really like the Metalite becouse I thought it was to 'edgy' I prefer a piece that I can impart the amount of edge I wish whenever I want with the way I blow it vs it being present all the time.

Captain Beeflat
06-21-2007, 02:43 PM
Alan...Of course I know that you are the former Medusa man; and I know your playing style...that's why I put a smiley after my last posting.
Yes, knowing your playing style I can imagine the Metalite being a tad too edgy for you.

Captain Beeflat
06-21-2007, 02:57 PM
Good playing.
How I admire your self control in playing it straight.
I have just been playing along with you but simply have to improvise all around it; and yes, my sound is considerably edgier.
We have totally differing styles; thank goodness that the saxophone is such a versatile instrument where the diametrically opposites are both right.

The A Train
06-21-2007, 03:35 PM
Thank you Captain for the comments. I have wanted to hear you for some time. I wish you would send me something with you on it. Would be nice to hear how seasoned blues sax veteran like yourself does it..on any tune.

Captain Beeflat
06-21-2007, 06:55 PM
Alan...with the type of bands I play in, and the assortment of venues, recording is the last thing on the agenda. The band has usually started the song before I even know what it is....let alone the key! Good fun though; keeps you on your toes.

Sidepipes
06-21-2007, 07:31 PM
Anyone ever heard of the 'Jade Series'? Here is one on ebay: http://cgi.ebay.com/Ida-Maria-Grassi-Italy-Professional-Tenor-Saxophone_W0QQitemZ180131537767QQihZ008QQcategoryZ16234QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

I've picked up a Grassi Alto that has the Jade rollers including the pinkie keys, as well as a jade in the octave thumb rest. There are no unique descriptors on the horn (Other than Grassi). Looks like your eBay tenor in appearance.

--Sidepipes

Captain Beeflat
06-21-2007, 08:23 PM
May I ask how it compares with your Mk6 alto? Most of us on this thread have experience of only the later Grassis, whereas, if your alto is similar to the ebay tenor, then it is a product of the 60s

Sidepipes
06-21-2007, 08:41 PM
Captain, it feels much like the VI, especially in the height of the palm keys. I'm going to tweak the neck cork so that I can use the same mouthpiece on both for a better sound comparison. Presently, I use a Selmer Jazz E on the VI and a Link STM 7 on the Grassi. For the relative cost, less than one tenth of the price of a VI, the Grassi was a bargain, especially to take on a hazardous gig.

--Sidepipes

Captain Beeflat
06-21-2007, 09:17 PM
Sidepipes. Most informative, my thanks. We have always been led to believe that the earlier Grassis were less than good....clearly not the case.

Sidepipes
06-22-2007, 04:55 PM
Captain, I used the old plumber's teflon tape technique, and put the Selmer Jazz E on the Grassi Jade alto. It played with more power (louder) than my VI. In all fairness, though, the VI has it's original plastic domed reso pads, and the Grassi has domed metal reso's, which could account for the difference. Adding fuel to the fire, noting current hot topics on SoTW, the Grassi does not have a high F#, but the VI does. O my, what did I just do?

--Sidepipes

Captain Beeflat
06-22-2007, 06:09 PM
Good to know that with similar reso's the performance would be equal in your view. Good to know also that the two horns are separated by about £2500.
Never understood this malarky about high F#; if you have it and do not like it then do not use it. My Grassi does not have high F# so I find another way. My R&C does have high F# so I use it...so what's the problem? :-)

milandro
01-22-2008, 11:39 AM
.....I've picked up a Grassi Alto that has the Jade rollers including the pinkie keys, as well as a jade in the octave thumb rest. --Sidepipes

Interesting thing to know.

I have a Grassi Baritone with Jade rollers.

I might buy a Grassi alto with Jade rollers too. It probably won't make me change my mind on my Martin, yet :twisted: , but one can always try it or pass it on to someone else ;) :) .
Are there any Grassi collectors out there? I have a Grassi alto " wonderful" model in almost pristine state (just a little tarnish of the silverplated keys)....let me know.

milandro
01-22-2008, 01:31 PM
one Grassi alto is now in the for sale section ;) get it as long as it is there!

warp x
03-18-2008, 10:42 PM
I saw a tenor for sale today, here in Amsterdam
In this shop. (http://palmguitars.com/)

Now that I'm reading this thread, I wish I'd looked better at the horn.
It had the green inlay on the octave key, and the action felt snappy.
I didn't play it, no time.