Mark VI not stamped on 1954 early versions?

[Bflat]

Is it true that "Mark VI" was not stamped on some of the first few Mark VI's in 1954?

Thanks fpr your input.

Bflat

[soundlink7]

Bflat,
I had the opportunity to swap mark vi's at a jam session for comparison purposes. The other tenor was a very early mark vi and did not have the same "S" on the neck key that my 122xxx neck and other typical VI's inherit. I remember from an older SOTW post that the early mark vi's had a different neck key ensignia, more like two "Ss" if I remember correctly. This tenor from 1954 was the best mark vi I ever played, it was noticably beefier, darker, and projected better than my vi. As far as the "Mark VI" stamp being present I am not sure, but I think it was stamped right above the bow on the ring just like mine.

Joe

[bruce bailey]

My 1964 Mark VI does not have it stamped anywhere on the horn and as I remember, europe models didn't have it.

[vincesf]

In relation to a Mark VI being stamped "Mark VI": Very early Mark VI's both French engraved and American engraved had no Mark VI stamping. American engraved Mark VI's had "MARK VI" stamped in bullet dotted notations on the upper rear portion of the body, above the octave key, on 56xxx and after. How much before 56xxx I do not know for certain. A trademark ® was added sometime after 6xxxx. All I can tell you is my 69400 has the ®, while my 59530 does not. The Mark VI with the trademark ® stamping shifted to the front bow ring in a bullet dotted notation sometime around early 94XXX, again an approximation. The notation stayed in the same place until the end of production at around 24XXXX, with one minor variation, sometime around 14XXXX, the MARK VI ® appeared in solid lettering and not the bullet dotted notation as on earlier models. As for French engraved VI's, I do not know when they were first stamped with MARK VI; however I have never seen a French engraved MARK VI with a ® as this was purely an American engraved practice as it is a U.S. Trademark designation. If I were to guess when MARK VI first appeared on French engraved saxes I would say probably at the same time that MARK VI appeared in the solid lettering in the 14XXXX range. While this information may not be 100% correct it is the best I have to offer at this time.

[griff136]

however I have never seen a French engraved MARK VI with a ®

Hi Vincesf - my silverplate 5 digit MK VI has both the early french engraving and the R in the circle. It does not howevr have MK VI engraved anywhere on the sax.

[Thomas]

My 111xxx french assembled-not factory engraved, has no MARK VI engraved/stamped anywhere but it does have an R stamped in a circle under the logo stamp on the bell

[Bflat]

Thank you everyone for your helpful input.

I have just purchased 57300 from the original owner. It has generous engraving and carries no MkVI markings.

Cheers,
Bflat

[shortwhite]

In relation to a Mark VI being stamped "Mark VI": Very early Mark VI's both French engraved and American engraved had no Mark VI stamping. American engraved Mark VI's had "MARK VI" stamped in bullet dotted notations on the upper rear portion of the body, above the octave key, on 56xxx and after

My 2 tenors, a 55xxx and a 57xxx both have "Mark VI" near the octave key.

[AndyW]

Bflat,
The other tenor was a very early mark vi and did not have the same "S" on the neck key that my 122xxx neck and other typical VI's inherit. I remember from an older SOTW post that the early mark vi's had a different neck key ensignia, more like two "Ss" if I remember correctly. This tenor from 1954 was the best mark vi I ever played, it was noticably beefier, darker, and projected better than my vi.
Joe

here's a pic from an old Selmer catalogue of an early Mk6 alto neck

http://www.donmack.com/Images/products/Selmer/Mk6Catalogue/FrontPage.jpg

the first (1954) Mk 6 tenors had the same "S", I've seen two personally.
they're, bodily, very like the SBA.

maybe the "S" changed with the neck angle -[ this of course makes
these early horns THE most rare & desirable - the Sweetness of the SBA with modern Mk6 keywork ;-)   ]


-A-

[rollen]

My 1954 alto has the neck as in the pic from the above post. Up by the octave key the letters "MARK" are above "VI", no R inside circle. There is no "Mark VI" on the bell brace. The engraving is a combined Mark VI and Balanced Action motif. Other differences are that the left hand spatula keys are slightly smaller, as if the aux F key.

[PB]

The french 56xxx tenor I have has this kind of neck, too. It is a pure Mk6: the body, the sound, the keywork. No SBA at all. So...

[vincesf]

It seems from the above posts that on American engraved Mark VI saxes, MARK VI was stamped above the octave key, even before 56XXX as the poster who has a 55XXX noted, which means that MARK VI did appear on many 1954 American engraved Mark VI's. Note that some state their sax has an ® on their sax but not MARK VI, which I believe they are referring to the stampings on the right side of the bell where all the Selmer logos appear and not the area I was referring to nn my first post. While we are on that area of the bell, there is another variation of note, and perhaps more. There was a change sometime around the mid 9XXXX where "BREVETE FRANCE & ETRANGER" above the HENRI SELMER PARIS wreath and "FABRIQUE en FRANCE par H.SELMER & C PLACE DANCOURT. PARIS" below the wreath was deleted. Yes the trademark ® appears in both versions of American and French engraved Mark VI saxes, but again this is not the ® I was referring to in my earlier post in response to the topic in this thread. The bottom line is that it is not important as to whether the sax is stamped with the MARK VI stamped onto the sax in 1954, as the most obvious/visible change in the transition from SBA to MARK VI is the octave mechanism with some variation of an"S" over the top of the neck and the flat black thumb rest at the octave key. Those that do not have MARK VI stamped onto their early MARK VI's probably have a French engraved sax, or a very early American engraved sax. Thanks, Vince

[vincesf]

In reading my last post, it seems that I went off in a tangent from the requested information, but there seemed to be confusion regarding the ® referred to in my last post, so I apologize for any confusion created, but I wanted to get the topic back on track, as I thought posters were referring to 2 different areas of stampings. Also, some may not be aware of the differences between American and French engraved/assembled Mark VI's, which also might affect the topic. Lastly, the information provided is based upon my observation of Mark VI's and are not concrete fact(s), as I have seen very few early Mark VI's to make broad generalizations.
Thanks again,
Vince

[Bflat]

Wow, I'm so impressed by the collective knowledge - and the passion - for all things sax - and in this case, Selmer.

BTW, many of you may know this, but I just learned that Selmer was responsible some years back for several very skookum looking "jazz" acoustic guitars - check it out

www.luthrie.net/bckgrnd.html

Oh great, another musical instrument (that I don't need and can't afford)to get all hot and bothered about!

Thanks all

Bflat[/url]

[Alucard90]

My old 1954 bari also does not have Mark VI anywhere on it. So i think they didn't give a name to it for first year model.

[jim70]

In relation to a Mark VI being stamped "Mark VI": Very early Mark VI's both French engraved and American engraved had no Mark VI stamping. American engraved Mark VI's had "MARK VI" stamped in bullet dotted notations on the upper rear portion of the body, above the octave key, on 56xxx and after. How much before 56xxx I do not know for certain. A trademark ® was added sometime after 6xxxx. All I can tell you is my 69400 has the ®, while my 59530 does not. The Mark VI with the trademark ® stamping shifted to the front bow ring in a bullet dotted notation sometime around early 94XXX, again an approximation. The notation stayed in the same place until the end of production at around 24XXXX, with one minor variation, sometime around 14XXXX, the MARK VI ® appeared in solid lettering and not the bullet dotted notation as on earlier models. As for French engraved VI's, I do not know when they were first stamped with MARK VI; however I have never seen a French engraved MARK VI with a ® as this was purely an American engraved practice as it is a U.S. Trademark designation. If I were to guess when MARK VI first appeared on French engraved saxes I would say probably at the same time that MARK VI appeared in the solid lettering in the 14XXXX range. While this information may not be 100% correct it is the best I have to offer at this time.
Truly appreciate the wealth of info on this.My original 53XXX '54 MKVI tenor does in fact have the bullet dot "Mark VI" up top near octave key,but being a long time relaquer,it is somewhat faint.Is there anyone or any possible way out there to restore this bullet-dot stamping to what it was before?Horn looks and plays great.
Thx

[maurizio]

Hi !
My alto MKVI M.79340 hasn't a MARKVI stamp, and the engraving are very simple...

[maurizio]

But it has a (R) under the company engraving.

[Andrew D]

My 140xxx Alto has in solid lettering MARK V1 just below the octave key on the upper side body with no ®. Adjacent to the upper C key

MARK MV1 ® is stamped on the front of the bell ring of my horn and it's bullet dotted.

Seems to make no real sense with regards to the above posters finding.

Most important thing is it's a killer player :)

[daddywagsmusic]

My alto, 71xxx, has light colored laq, nickel plated keys, and does not say mark vi anywhere, but it does have all the fancy euro engraving all over the bell and bow. I have seen other pics of horns like mine, with light laq. and nickel plated keys, and last winter I met and got to play with Paquito D. and he said he used to have an alto EXACTLY like mine, around the same serial number, with light laq and nickel keys with euro engraving and it did not say MKVI anywhere on it. I also have a soprano with the same color, but its from 1971, and it says MKVI on it, and has engraving on the bell. My tenor is a mint closet horn re-born a year ago when I got it, only played 15-20 times when it was new, 148xxx, that has dark laq and american engraving and says MKVI on the front of the bow with solid line stamping of the letters and the VI$0.02