How to fatten up a Dukoff D on alto?

[Edo]

I play an old pre-Chu Conn alto, with surprisingly minimum intonation issues (I can even tune to D instead of Eb!)..I love the projection of the Dukoff D but it sounds like 'eeeee' instead of sounding like between 'aaaaa' and 'ooooo'..I don't know if you guys understand... :?

How to fatten up the sound? Oh yes, I use #2 reed..'cause the piece might have been refaced to 0.100"..

I play Dukoff D too on tenor and am happy with the tone I'm getting..

Thanks..

[sessionsax]

Have a mouthpiece reface lower the baffle a bit and open the chamber some.

[Giles]

Long Tones. Lots and Lots of Long Tones.

[Edo]

Thanks guys..

I'm not sure refacing is an option...I live far far far away... :cry:

I want my Dukoff alto to sound like my Dukoff tenor...is it even possible? :? :wink: :shock:

Been trying an old Rico Jazz #2 1/2 and getting a bit fuller tone..but brighter too..

And I might get my hands on a BG Standard Jazz..

How dark and how fat could a Dukoff D alto be?

[colibri]

It's not quite possible to make an alto piece sound like a tenor. It's not the mouthpiece, but the neck and the bore of the horn that makes an alto sound different from a tenor. For a thicker sound you can use a harder reed. What facing number is your Dukoff? To me, a #2.5 reed seems a bit soft even for a Dukoff D8. My current set up is a Jumbo Java A95 with Rico #4 reeds. It gives me a pretty thick sound while maintaining enough edge for fusion playing.

[colibri]

How dark and how fat could a Dukoff D alto be?

Not very. You can take in less mouthpiece into your mouth, but since it has a high baffle, it's hard to make it as dark as, let's say a Meyer.

[Johannes Gerber]

Edo, where in the world do you live, where's far away?

By lowering the baffle a bit and opening the chamber on the Dukoff will fatten the tone. Hard reeds are not always an option since not all can play #4's on an open mouthpiece, not mentioning controlling it. Now again about control - by opening the facing to about .100 will also fatten the tone (together with the baffle and chamber work)

I can send you a mp3 sample of one of my pieces on eBay now - it's .098 medium baffle - large chamber.

However, getting a tenor like tone on alto is something more to the player. I work with Lional Kielly here in South Africa - I do his mouthpiece work and his students's. He's one of the best tenor jazz cats in SA, and he gets a tenor like tone on everything he touches, any mouthpiece on alto give him a full very thick sounding tone, because that's what's in his head, and he's been playing tenor for 46 years.

Like someone also said, long tones, to produce a big tone on alto requires very good air support, and good ambouchure.

Regards
JG

[Riff]

How to fatten up the sound?

Buy a Link! 8)

[SaxColuss]

Edo lives in Jakarta,Indonesia.even here in s'pore,there ain't any mp refacer around.....oh well... :roll:

[Johannes Gerber]

What a pity!

I live in South Africa. I'll find out if SA Airlines does a direct flight to Indonesia - that might mean that airmail won't take long.

Take care :-)

[sessionsax]

Take a look at Johannes Gerbers pieces -- they are a work of art -- and from my understanding of mouthpiece design (I know a bit) his pieces are very sound in their design. His jazz piece has a real post bop Guardala look about it.

I was looking forward to getting one when I found out I owe the IRS about 2 grand :cry:

Also, get one now, his prices are going up (as they should for the quality).

In a couple of years -- his pieces will be in the same price range as all of the top custom pieces.

[jd]

edo, i use dukoffs for tenor and alto. over the last few years i tried using a rovner dark lig on my dukoff . it really darkens it up and makes the playability easy.for tenor it didnt work good so ive been using the stamdard lig. also what kind of reeds are you using? ive been on fibracell for a couple of years and really like them . but try the rovner dark for alto. it made a big diff in feel and sound to me.

[Kosma]

So why do you guys pick the brightest mouthpiece on the planet and then try to darken it?

[Johannes Gerber]

Sometimes..when you live far away, like EDO and me, you don't have access to a lot of mouthpieces - then you might consider changing your piece some till you like it more - after all, that's how I learnt.

Regards
JG
www.geocities.com/jgerberza

[Troy]

Come on, guys! No where is THAT far away. I mean, I bought my Lawton from Bootman in Australia. I live in Seattle, WA USA. The mail worked fine. Less than a week.

If you really want it refaced, mail it to Mojobari (or someone else) and get it fixed how you want it. :)

[jd]

kosma, i picked dukoff because after trying everything the dukoff is the easiest most playable piece for me. plays with power and good intonation. i like bright but the rovner helped make it even easier to play and took some of the edge off. beautiful sound. i have a drawer full of alto pieces but the dukoff is the most playable for me. i also like the beechler bellite but they require more "work"

[Kosma]

JD, Can't argue with that. I'm no stranger to Dukoff myself. Many years ago I played D8's on alto and tenor. I bought them because they played easy and they were loud, which I needed at the time, and because there was a very limited selection at this store. I played them for several years exclusively. I knew next to nothing about mpcs then but after a while I realized that I didn't like the sound I was getting. It was very edgy and bright. It took me years of trial and error to find the right type of mpc for me. I hope the young guys realize how lucky they are to have this wealth of saxophonic knowledge at their fingertips. This forum would have saved me literally years of searching. It can't replace the search, but it sure narrows it down.

[jd]

I hope the young guys realize how lucky they are to have this wealth of saxophonic knowledge at their fingertips. This forum would have saved me literally years of searching. It can't replace the search, but it sure narrows it down.

true!!
i wish i had this forum 24 (or more )years ago so i could have known more. ive tried just about everything and keep coming back to dukoffs for tenor and alto. the tenor always got "the sound" i loved. still do.but that alto......i really had to learn to coax that alto dukoff. you know play with finnesse .
so what are you using these days for tenor /alto?

[Edo]

wow..so many replies..

Yes I'm so very grateful to have known this forum...the knowledge I gather from here sure saves me alot..time and money..

:arrow: I use Dukoff on alto hoping that I could get that certain quality in tone I have on my tenor..I use Dukoff D8 on tenor and get a pretty versatile tone..I can even play standards on it..

:arrow: And...as Johannes Gerber said, I don't have good access to international tradings, I did 8 eBay transaction and only 50% arrived in about two weeks, 1 lost, and the rest came in in more than a month's time..the mail service isn't all the same in every country y'know..

The local music stores only have Bergs tenor, Links alto, and LA Sax..and I don't like any...oh..and one more..they still have Rico Royal Metalite! :) The other advantage of living in a third world country with sooo late update on the merchandising..and I can't even find any reeds other than Rico products and only a few so incomplete Vandorens..

:arrow: And...I don't have that much money to experiment... :( I'm just a poor computer science student..only have occasional gigs..so, I must constantly look for "hidden treasures" and the road to new designer mouthpieces is non-existant to me.. :wink:

Do you believe me that 2 out of 4 Dukoffs that I got from international trades is below US$40, one is about US$60...one is my first metal mouthpiece, an interesting-sounding nickel plated Dukoff D8..it's over US$100... :cry: :) I even got a Yani Metal 7 below US$40! (but lost!! :cry: :cry: )

:arrow: And...I found the Dukoff to have the best playability..I can tongue from low Bb to altissimo on alto...(umm..more difficult on tenor.. :? )

I really drool when I look at eBay where there are lots of "hidden treasures"..there's so many thing that I would try and play-test, but with the current conditions, I just have to settle and work with what I have now..

I'm even not sure I can afford a Rovner...hehe...well, that's where creativity walks in..just have to make a Rovner clone.. :twisted:

I envy all of you who have better access to quality products..patience young man...patience..the time will come..hehe..

Sooo...back to basic...work hard on the mouthpiece, eh? :)

Oh yea..setups..

Tenor:
D8 SPC or D8 nickel (both ca. 0.106") with Rico Royal #3 1/2

Alto:
D8 SPC (circa 0.098" ~> equiv to D11??) with Rico Royal #2

Wow..that was long..! Thanks for reading... :)