Old sax restoration

[janderson42]

I found an old selmer sax at a pawn shop recently and really liked the look of it. I did not get a chance to play it, but all the keys were responsive and the pads looked decent so I think it plays. I didn't get the serial number but the two pads on the bell were on the reverse side and it looked old. I have been playing sax in a high school band for four years and know a little about how they work. Does anybody know what type of sax it could be? Also I was looking to try and restore it myself can somebody tell me how to take the lacquer off and put knew pads and springs on the horn and what type of equipment I need to do so? Also how do I get the dents out of the horn? I did not plan to put new lacquer on it but to just leave it bare brass because I like the way it looks.

thanks

[Oric Muso]

How are we suppsoed to tell what it is when you've given us no information but the maker?
Tell us the serial number and if possible post a picture then we can help you out.

For the repair stuff there's plenty of info here already. try searching the forum!

You don't really sound like you know much about repairwork at all so I reckon you should get a cheap horn to practise on before you let yourself loose on a Selmer. Then again, it may not be a proper Selmer Paris and could be a Pennsylvania or something that isn't worth much.

Pictures!!!

[milandro]

assuming that you have found a Selmer France (Selmer usa, Selmer London aren't Selmer at all! Watch out! ) it could be a model 22, 26 or 28 or one of the 4 Selmer super model.

start here for identification and learn about the history of these horns
http://www.saxpics.com/?v=gal&c=1037

I don't think that you can un-dent your saxophone unless you are already very experienced with advanced metal work. Re-padding a saxophone isn't that easy either.

Why don't you search the archives of this forum trying to get some of the knowledge you need to decide to have some expert do something that you would end up, in all likelihood, not being able to accomplish?

Good luck!

[fred12]

Hope I'm not hijacking the thread, but - just how do you know if it 's a Mark VI or not? I'm told that they don't all say "mark vi" on them.

[hornfixer]

I'm told that they don't all say "mark vi" on them.

Don't listen to that person.

Welcome to the forum janderson42.

[JayeSF]

In answering the OP's original Q:

1) Do NOT disclose to anyone here what town you saw this horn in....or about 50 people will be descending on all of the pawnshops within a 30 mile radius of you...wherever in the world you may be....:|

2) You are going to have to either post a pic of it here, or cross-referense it with other pictures/info (such as Milandro provided) to determine what model it is.

3) Go to the "sax and body and finish" and "sax repair/maintenance" sections of this forum and search for terms like "unlacquer, delacquer" and "repad"....to find some helpful threads.


IMHO...it isn't all that difficult to do what you are proposing. But also IMHO...while you may well be able to do a successful disassembly, & successful delacquer of the body and keys....you certainly will NOT be able to achieve a good level of repadding, re-springing, and regulation of the keys given this would be your first attempt at it. It takes time, it takes some practice.

As I said, the actual work is not something which is a magical mystery, closely guarded by the secret society of sax techs (although there are those who would have you believe that it IS just that)....

But it really takes time and experience on a few horns to get it down, at least respectably (most folks start on old vintage stencil horns which they pick up for around $100)....and this, providing you are mechanically inclined.

NOW..as an alternative, IF...once you ID the model of horn, and IF it is a particularly special one....and IF you can wrestle it from the pawnbroker for a good price....you should also consider investing in a professional sax tech to do the overhaul for you.

If you can pick it up for a good price, investing $500-800 for an overhaul into a special old Selmer is certainly going to return the investment both monetarily...and horn-i-tarily.....

PS ~ why was this moved to the selmer section ? More apropos for the tech section, no ???????

[bruce bailey]

I will guess that it IS a Selmer Paris if the bell keys are on the left side. The US stenciled Selmers were mostly opposing side keys. the serial number will be in the under 20,000 range. I have been repairing saxes for 46 years and I would not attempt dent work.
If this IS a 22, 26 etc. the most it could be worth is about $2,000 if it is a cigar cutter in mint condition. these just don't command the money that the BAs and later do.

[janderson42]

Thanks for all the advice, I haven't bought the horn yet and can't get any pictures of it. I think it could be the model 22, 26, or 28 and it could be the cigar cutter or the radio improved from what I saw on the link. Those are the only ones I saw that had the pads on the reverse side of the bell, and I know it had pads so it couldn't be the padless. If that is true doesn't that mean it was made before 1935 and how can I tell if it is selmer france and not selmer usa or selmer london and why are they no good? Also I don't know why it was moved I didn't do it.

[milandro]

If you look for information this place is a gold mine, but, sorry to say this to you on your first day on the forum..........the use of the search button is paramount in order to acquire valuable information.......
here Pete (the creator of saxpics....) lists all the " Selmers" other than the kosher Selmer France.
http://forum.saxontheweb.net/showpost.php?p=201163&postcount=5
some are very good indeed, some aren't so good. In any case the big bucks are only commanded by Selmer France and only for the most sought after models. Before you embark into expensive restoration projects (really do not be tempted to make this your first adventure in repairland ! ) think that you need a positive ID to determine value.

[Grumps]

I will guess that it IS a Selmer Paris if the bell keys are on the left side. The US stenciled Selmers were mostly opposing side keys.
I've got a USA Selmer Signet with the two bell keys on the underside. I would be truly surprised if a pawn shop owner had a "Made in France" Selmer and didn't know it had value.

[janderson42]

Well when I ask him how much he wanted for it the lady with him told him it was a selmer and he looked it up on the internet and said he wanted $225 for it but I got him down to $150. So I don't think he has actually looked at the horn it was one of several old horns he had in the back of his store so I think he just bought them from people whose parents or grandparents played in bands and none of them knew what they were worth because he also had trumpets and trombones that were old and he specializes in guns and guitars.

[paulio]

Well when I ask him how much he wanted for it the lady with him told him it was a selmer and he looked it up on the internet and said he wanted $225 for it but I got him down to $150. So I don't think he has actually looked at the horn it was one of several old horns he had in the back of his store so I think he just bought them from people whose parents or grandparents played in bands and none of them knew what they were worth because he also had trumpets and trombones that were old and he specializes in guns and guitars.

Trust me he will have a good idea of the value, the way people make a living out of buying and selling is understanding the value of their inventory.

[cymru97]

Trust me he will have a good idea of the value, the way people make a living out of buying and selling is understanding the value of their inventory.

That may be the case more often than not, but... I have found MANY great deals at pawn shops including a lovely 10M, 156 Aristocrat, Martin Indiana, Yani 800 'Martin' Stencil, King Zephyr alto, and those are just the ones off the top of my head.

Pawn shop owners know what they have invested in an item and look for a certain percentage profit when they flip it. Some invest time and energy in researching and marketing items while others look to move items, the trick is locating the latter. There are three main pawn shops in my town and each has a different business model.

[AMASAX]

Better make up your mind, sooner rather than later. The more times you go back, the more the pawn broker is gonna think he mighta missed sumpin' on this one and do a little more research.

Also, you ain't the only 'looker' in the entire town. Someone else may scoop you on this deal.

Shouldn't be that hard to get a serial number. And, while you're looking: serials on the early horns are stamped on the right side of the bell, along with 'Henri Selmer', 'Paris', etc. If it says Henri Selmer & Paris, just buy the damned thing and consider it a steal.

You can always peddle it later for more than a couple hundred $$.