The M70 chronicle [Archive] - Sax on the Web Forum

yaucante

05-14-2009, 08:04 PM

Dolnet fans, hold your breath,

After 3 dire years, I have succeeded to gather enough money to have my lacquered M70 tenor rebuilt. The pads were dry, it needed mechanical adjustment and so forth. It is now in the hands of a qualified Paris repairman (a guy specialized in vintage saxes who actually works on building his own saxophone). Before summer, I should get my hands on it and I should be able to give more precise information on this model, instead of the usual speculations that we feed on. You'll get photos, impressions, sound, I promise. I'm not a tenor player (I'll have to buy a mouthpiece) but I'll do my best and, in due course, I hope to find a Mark VI tenor player in the vicinity to organize a comparative test that I'm sure many of you will be interested to hear.

Of course, this is a teaser, let's talk about it again in 3 years...! I mean 3 months.[Impnt]:D

Cheers.

yaucante

07-15-2009, 11:06 PM

Hello Dolnet planet !

Given the astonishing number of replies to this new post in 3 months, I'm afraid Dolnet fans just got tired, died out, or went back to other brands...Well, too bad, I just got my M70 back from a very fine repairman in Paris. He did a great job and I could give it a short try with a 6 rubber link (I did not have any other piece available). The tech himself praised the sound of the beast even if the ergonomics needs some getting used to. And man does it play! Too early to say much else after such a quick road test. I've just moved and it kept me away from music so that I did not get a chance to find a decent music store in town to try a few mouthpieces. I'm going away for 2 weeks and the follow-up is scheduled for August. I hope this will attract some readers. I will be able to post photos and, hopefully, sound. And I will be looking for some MarkSixer around in order to perform the much awaited side by side test of Dolnet vs Selmer...Just for the fun of it. We'll see who will be able to recognize the sound of each brand...:D. Get ready! [Impnt]

JayeSF

07-15-2009, 11:38 PM

Hehehe...yes, I know...I think it is fair to say that the Dolnet section has now surpassed both the Noblet section and the Malerne section as being the sleepiest...

isn't there a tumble-weed smilie somewhere ?:?

Glad the tech work was a success....just curious...what ergonomic aspects are you referring to ?

I have a Belair which also was worked back into playing shape and it is just a FINE, FINE tenor. Bigger sounding than most European horns I have played....sort of leans towards the more big American Vintage Tenor sound, but still smoother.....I cannot compare it to a Selmer, but I have been able to compare it to several other very reputable Tenors...2 Malernes, an Orsi, a Holton 241, a King Zephyr, a Holton Revelation, and a Martin Handcraft.

Yauc...post a photo !

supruet

07-17-2009, 08:08 AM

Just bought two M70s. One with F#. Another without. Both need extensive repair.

The ergonomic of M70 is the bell which turns to your left (from playing position). So it is best played with the horn to your right side of the body. The nicest position would be sitting, the horn to your right, and the bell will lie on your lap.

The position with the horn dead in front of you is that the bell will be too left. Looking from the audiences, people will see that you are side-playing your horn.

spiderjames

07-22-2009, 03:01 AM

I have had several Belairs but I have never been able to get my hands on one of these. I think these are one of the coolest looking horns ever made. A Dolnet's quirkiness is part of its charm.

milandro

07-22-2009, 05:50 AM

de M70 is one of the nicest horns out there with tons of personality and originality......difficult to find as opposed to the tons of Bel Airs on the market. I will buy one if and when it comes along for the right price. Getting one with the quirky high F# is mandatory for the true collector.

JayeSF

07-22-2009, 07:31 AM

The position with the horn dead in front of you is that the bell will be too left. Looking from the audiences, people will see that you are side-playing your horn.

Hey..if you are shooting for the Lester Young thang...then that's exactly what you'd want to look like ;)

Just landed a Cartier on eFlay for $300...appears to be a BelAir, but I have to have a closer look at it...it doesn't quite seem identical to my BelAir....

Meyer

07-29-2009, 06:58 AM

I just got hold of a beautifull silverplated M70 tenor saxophone.

Most pads are dried out, so it will need to be repaired. It was a bit odd to hold the first two - three times, do to the "left" bell position.

electricfigue

08-03-2009, 06:38 AM

milandro

08-03-2009, 07:12 AM

electricfigue

08-04-2009, 04:39 AM

I know we are speaking about tenors here, but anyone has first hand experience on Dolnet sopranos?, I am asking about the sound and the intonation not the ergonomics.
I have read very differents opinions and I have not the chance to play one until this moment. Thanks in advance.

well this is a thread about the Dolnet M70 model (was there ever a M70 soprano.......I wonder) if you run a search with the word " soprano" in the Dolnet section of the forum
http://forum.saxontheweb.net/search.php?searchid=10452888

that is what you get,........... which should answer your question. A lot of people like the Dolnet sopranos . I have only seen Bel-Air types but it could very well be that there were other series too.

Thanks for your help, Milandro.
I think (but I am not sure) there is a M70 soprano model.
I believe this one is similar to the Bel Air (the same body) but the difference more evident is on the D# and C key spatulas, on the Bel Air are hexagonal and in this model are rounded.
Anyway, I was thinking to learn something more about the sound and intonation if some SOTW friend is playing one.

electricfigue

08-26-2009, 07:52 AM

Well, the day after my question about M70 Dolnet sopranos, I have bought one which I understand is an M70 soprano.
I will post photos ASAP, this one looks like it had been in some time capsule, it´s almost mint condition (except a little ding near the left thumb support), silverplated (not nickel), with gold washed inside bell, original mouthpiece, cap and lig, red pads (I don´t know if are original), original case (the case shows some use but in excellent condition) and also the certificate from the Dolnet factory.
I will post also my impression about the instrument, but at this moment I am too much happy to be objective about this soprano (I received the Dolnet yesterday), but the sound emission and tone are just wonderful.

milandro

08-26-2009, 08:05 AM

it should be pretty easy to say if it is a M70 soprano because all the M70 (tenor and alto) that I've seen had a serial number that started with M70.........also, the M70 featured (although not always) a high F# key (also seen in the royal jazz sometimes) and the mechanics were " balanced action " and required in the horns with a curved bell to be sharply pointing to the left.

yaucante

08-26-2009, 12:07 PM

Hello,

I'm happy to have triggered some kind of revival of this otherwise sleepy question. And if it helps discover a M70 soprano...Milandro's almost right, M70 serial usually start or finish with M70. Mine reads 88790 M70. I haven't been able to get my hands on a decent tenor mouthpiece since I got the horn last month. I moved to a place where there is no saxophone dealer and I'd like to try some pieces on it rather than buy one online (since I'm not a tenor player at all, my axe is baritone). So, it will take some more time before I can post sound and reviews. Sorry about that. [Impnt]
Hopefully, we'll learn more about that wonderful soprano of Electricfigue in the meantime. Please send pics ! Here are a couple of shots from my own M70 tenor. It's not pristine (a couple of resolderings, some tarnish spots here and there) but it looks very good. At the same time, I also got my hands on a wonderful little silver SML rev D which has been revised and play superbly. It's gonna be fun...

milandro

08-26-2009, 01:19 PM

I stand corrected.......;) :) I think I only ever saw M70 with the M70 before the number, who knows why some had it before and some after! Very frustrating knowing that there is no data about Dolnets

milandro

08-26-2009, 01:24 PM

I stand corrected.......;) :) I think I only ever saw M70 with the M70 before the number, who knows why some had it before and some after! Very frustrating knowing that there is no data about Dolnets

yaucante

08-27-2009, 09:57 PM

Hello Dolnet fans,

Here are some fresh news. I did get to play-test my M70 with 4 mouthpieces today. Quite an exhilarating experience. I managed to find a local dealer who had in stock a Vandoren v16 T7, a STM metal 8*Link, a Lakey (did not understand what the tip opening was) and another Ling which read RG something, sorry, I'm not a Link guy and I've pretty much stuck to my plastic Runyon on Baritone for the last 10 years...That says it all.

So, with all the caveats of not being a Tenor player, of not having put my hands on a Mark VI, even VII or anythin alike (oh, sorry, I did play a stuffy Mark VI baritone once, not impressive), I started to blow in this Dolnet (reeds were either Lavoz medium or medium hard). Oh my, does it have something special. First, the intonation was dead on with any of those pieces. The Lakey was not appealing, kind of stuffy. The Vandoren did a good job, very even in all registers, but not much bite, very "classical". The RG something Link was hard to play, too small for me, but had great projection. THe best result was with the STM Link and medium reed, even though it was a tad too open for me. But it gives an idea of how versatile the horn is.

Guys, this horn lets you play incredible pianissimo and has a nice juicy lower end as well. I got used to the ergonomics quickly except for the low Bb that's too far, as on Martins, and the oddly placed High F#. Apart from that, you need to find the right position for the octave key to work well with the offset bell. But I liked the horn a lot. That's all for now, more when I get new pieces and sound to post.

Cheers

electricfigue

08-27-2009, 10:48 PM

Thanks Yaucante and Milandro for the info. Well, maybe if you help me we can know something more about my Dolnet soprano.
I believed it was an M70 because of the serial number 854XX,according to saxpics it could fit into the M70 gap, also the C and D# spatulas are rounded, not hexagonal like the BelAir or Imperial.
Also if you see the case handle is tipycal of the seventies but I am not an expert.
In the other hand the palm keys are similar to the BelAir, not the M70.
Maybe this photos can help to know something more, or give some light to the Dolnet history.
The serial number doesn´t have any M70 before/after the number, and no high F#.
At the moment I have tried with 2 mouthpieces a Selmer S80 E (wich I usually use), and the original Dolnet (more closed tip than selmer and rounded chamber instead of square), with Vandoren #2.5, both plays Ok, but I liked more the Dolnet one. I will like to try it with a metal Selmer D or E, when I found one I will write about it.
If you can give some new information you are welcome.

electricfigue

08-27-2009, 10:54 PM

More Pics.

yaucante

08-28-2009, 11:36 AM

Electricfigue,

From what I can see (pictures appear small), it does not look like a M70 because of the pinky, the engraving and a few other features similar to Bel air. As saxpics lists belair serial number ranging from 40 to 80***, it may well be a late bel air from the 60s or even early 70. Does not look like a later universal model. It's also more coherent since Dolnet manufactured many sopranos under the belair series. To my knowledge, the M70 soprano is still to be found. In any case, to be in tune with the tenor and alto, it would have to be a curved sop with an offset bell ! (or some kind of crooked saxello, ah,ah). But your sax seems to be in very good shape cosmetically. Hope that it plays as good as it looks.

To be continued.

:D

milandro

08-28-2009, 01:18 PM

It really looks like any other Bel-air soprano that I have seen. There are really no reliable information on Dolnet serial numbers, in fact we don't even know the significance of letters in the serial numbers! All the M70 that I have seen carry the M70 within the serial number (before or after the number). Even just estimates of the relationship between serial number and production date are guess-stimates really. Baritones and Soprano are less likely to have been following the Alto and Tenor developments. (As it happened to the Selmer Mark VI too tthat, at least officially, never became a VII although some late VI's were marked as VII's).

electricfigue

08-28-2009, 03:57 PM

Hello, and thank you both again to share your knowledge about Dolnet.
Now, I know that I am a happy owner of a Dolnet Bel Air silverplated soprano circa seventies. :)
I have a lot of questions about Dolnet and french saxophones in general, but I believe I will get the answers little by little here on SOTW.
I modified the size of the pics to load it to the forum, if you want to see it with more details send me a PM and I will send it to you by mail.-
Thanks.-Electricfigue.

milandro

08-28-2009, 10:46 PM

I use a hosting site (Image shack) where I upload pictures (reduced in weight by photoshop save for web feature) ,the hosting site generates a ling that you paste in your message. If you do this, you can upload practically any size you want on this site because it is a link on a external site. Typically 1200 pixels wide pictures weigh about 200Kb, so they are light weight and load very quick.

supruet

08-30-2009, 09:03 AM

After a year, I ended up owning a lot of Dolnets.

Now I have 2 M70 tenor. One with F#; another w/o. The latter one plays great. Just got it back from the technician yesterday. Sound is so sweet. The projection is not that great but it does not bother me (why I want someones to hear that I am a bad player :P). Playing position is very hard to do but I think it requires sometimes to adapt myself to the horn. M70 tenor w/F# is still being repair due to a lot of posts collapsed in transit and the F# mechanism is bent.

One M70 alto in the same faith with repairer. Many posts collapses and dents.

One Bel Air Royal Jazz alto from bboukas here in SOTW. Great alto. Thick sounds with a lot of extra keys. Intonation is also good.

And one Bel Air Tenor in Nickel plate... sound very big but intonation is the big problem. Trying to selling this one off.

So happy with M70 tenor.

Regarding the mouthpiece, I tried M70 tenor with Francois Louis Spectruoso 315 ML. It sounds great. Intonation is spot on. Easy subtones. Altissimo can be achieved for the first time after 2 years on-and-off lessons. :shock: Good response to change in volume. By the way, I used LaVoz MS.

JayeSF

09-05-2009, 02:36 AM

Hmmm...
It's the criticism which comes up most often on Dolnets, whether alto or tenor....the intonation issues.

Seems to be the reputation, and a bit of a crap-shoot because I have read the same thing regardless of the model of horn. I find it odd....

I have a Cartier I am gonna work up soon...it appears to be a BelAir....my working BelAir is nice in the intonation dept.; wonder what I'll discover with the Cartier ?